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dogbiscuit |
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Could you run through Verifiability not Truth once more?
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After stripping this down through the layers of mis-information, it is a most peculiar case, but then Mr A is a most peculiar person.
It seems a number of women, on the basis of very little personal contact, decided that they fancied a shag - it all seems in the grand tradition of groupy-ism going back to the 60s and the various pop stars of that era. Their casual approach to sex lowers the expected standards of behaviour in my book, so my initial reaction is that I don't have a lot of sympathy.
However, if it did turn out to be true that Mr A deliberately and deceptively did things like damaging a condom and initiating sex whilst asleep (though there is something rather odd in the telling which makes it sound as if she never woke up, which then brings up the question of whether there was drink or drugs involved) then it does turn the situation into something more akin to a deliberate assault. I think in the modern age, it is understood that the basic standard of casual sex, especially based on such a fleeting meeting, is that it is appropriate to have protected sex. In fact, it seems rather reckless of Mr A that he should seek to risk catching something interesting, given his predilection for casual sex - perhaps a sign of some self-destructive tendencies.
The whole casual sex arrangement of the groupies giving service to their anointed one is rather cultish, and it is that imbalance of power that makes me uneasy, though it seems to me that these were mature women taking conscious decisions.
The lack of self-control and ego does make a convincing story in the context of previously revealed splits in WikiLeaks and the determined release of diplomatic tittle-tattle that is damaging without there being a perceived benefit. Convincing story? Well, it also seems to be the case that it is not a fabrication but too well founded in actual events to be a CIA-style plot.
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TungstenCarbide |
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Allegedly shot down by stray Ukrainian missile
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QUOTE(dogbiscuit @ Mon 20th December 2010, 10:17pm) After stripping this down through the layers of mis-information, it is a most peculiar case, but then Mr A is a most peculiar person.
It seems a number of women, on the basis of very little personal contact, decided that they fancied a shag - it all seems in the grand tradition of groupy-ism going back to the 60s and the various pop stars of that era. Their casual approach to sex lowers the expected standards of behaviour in my book, so my initial reaction is that I don't have a lot of sympathy.
However, if it did turn out to be true that Mr A deliberately and deceptively did things like damaging a condom and initiating sex whilst asleep (though there is something rather odd in the telling which makes it sound as if she never woke up, which then brings up the question of whether there was drink or drugs involved) then it does turn the situation into something more akin to a deliberate assault. I think in the modern age, it is understood that the basic standard of casual sex, especially based on such a fleeting meeting, is that it is appropriate to have protected sex. In fact, it seems rather reckless of Mr A that he should seek to risk catching something interesting, given his predilection for casual sex - perhaps a sign of some self-destructive tendencies.
The whole casual sex arrangement of the groupies giving service to their anointed one is rather cultish, and it is that imbalance of power that makes me uneasy, though it seems to me that these were mature women taking conscious decisions.
The lack of self-control and ego does make a convincing story in the context of previously revealed splits in WikiLeaks and the determined release of diplomatic tittle-tattle that is damaging without there being a perceived benefit. Convincing story? Well, it also seems to be the case that it is not a fabrication but too well founded in actual events to be a CIA-style plot.
Assange is a vile animal, plain and simple. He's benefited greatly by the laws of society and a standard of living built for him in the western world, while tearing down the institutions that brought him that life and hiding behind its civilized laws. Reading this story in particular, he sounds like he has no conscience. The article dings at least 10 of 15 traits of a psychopath; *Glibness and Superficial Charm *Manipulative and Conning *Grandiose Sense of Self, Feels entitled to certain things as "their right." *Pathological Lying *Lack of Remorse, Shame or Guilt *Shallow Emotions *Incapacity for Love *Need for Stimulation *Callousness/Lack of Empathy *Poor Behavioral Controls/Impulsive Nature *Early Behavior Problems/Juvenile Delinquency *Irresponsibility/Unreliability *Promiscuous Sexual Behavior/Infidelity *Lack of Realistic Life Plan/Parasitic Lifestyle *Criminal or Entrepreneurial Versatility This post has been edited by TungstenCarbide:
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wikieyeay |
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QUOTE(SB_Johnny @ Tue 21st December 2010, 7:48pm) QUOTE(Kelly Martin @ Tue 21st December 2010, 8:48am) Wait, I thought we were talking about Assange; why are you listing Jimmy Wales' traits?
Assange did an interview on the BBC this morning, FYI. Jimmy could have stood in for him perfectly, assuming he could pull off the accent. Jimbo must be kicking himself over the fact that he's not the world's most famous Wiki* website leader. Taken out by a white-haired Australian. What a humiliation.
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Milton Roe |
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Known alias of J. Random Troll
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QUOTE(wikieyeay @ Thu 23rd December 2010, 3:10pm) QUOTE(SB_Johnny @ Tue 21st December 2010, 7:48pm) QUOTE(Kelly Martin @ Tue 21st December 2010, 8:48am) Wait, I thought we were talking about Assange; why are you listing Jimmy Wales' traits?
Assange did an interview on the BBC this morning, FYI. Jimmy could have stood in for him perfectly, assuming he could pull off the accent. Jimbo must be kicking himself over the fact that he's not the world's most famous Wiki* website leader. Taken out by a white-haired Australian. What a humiliation. In revenge, the peregrinations of Assange's bodily fluids and his predilection for assignations with admirers are being given far more extensive and detailed analysis on WP, than they were when Jimbo Wales was the target, back in the day. What the media is doing to Assange is almost Clinton-esque. No, I take it back-- it is Clinton-esque. (I would say Arbuckle-esque but nobody would know what the hell I meant by THAT.) Only political revenge can generate this much interest in a sexual episode in which nobody was injured, and the delicate and tangled matter of what things were and weren't given permission for (as we go down our checklist of the many pages of possible sexual acts), are a matter of he-said/she-said. In my world, if a woman is psychologically devastated by something physical that a man did to her, she usually doesn't go out to buy food with which to make him breakfast, then drive him to the train station. Then find out he had sex with another woman four days before, THEN go screaming to the cops about having been abused. Abused she might have been, but the time to decide THAT had long since gone, methinks. There has to be a statute of limitations for that sort of thing, even if both sides admit to exactly what happened. Be reasonable here.
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TungstenCarbide |
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Allegedly shot down by stray Ukrainian missile
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QUOTE(Milton Roe @ Fri 24th December 2010, 1:19am) QUOTE(wikieyeay @ Thu 23rd December 2010, 3:10pm) QUOTE(SB_Johnny @ Tue 21st December 2010, 7:48pm) QUOTE(Kelly Martin @ Tue 21st December 2010, 8:48am) Wait, I thought we were talking about Assange; why are you listing Jimmy Wales' traits? Assange did an interview on the BBC this morning, FYI. Jimmy could have stood in for him perfectly, assuming he could pull off the accent. Jimbo must be kicking himself over the fact that he's not the world's most famous Wiki* website leader. Taken out by a white-haired Australian. What a humiliation. In revenge, the peregrinations of Assange's bodily fluids and his predilection for assignations with admirers are being given far more extensive and detailed analysis on WP, than they were when Jimbo Wales was the target, back in the day. What the media is doing to Assange is almost Clinton-esque. No, I take it back-- it is Clinton-esque. (I would say Arbuckle-esque but nobody would know what the hell I meant by THAT.) Only political revenge can generate this much interest in a sexual episode in which nobody was injured, and the delicate and tangled matter of what things were and weren't given permission for (as we go down our checklist of the many pages of possible sexual acts), are a matter of he-said/she-said. In my world, if a woman is psychologically devastated by something physical that a man did to her, she usually doesn't go out to buy food with which to make him breakfast, then drive him to the train station. Then find out he had sex with another woman four days before, THEN go screaming to the cops about having been abused. Abused she might have been, but the time to decide THAT had long since gone, methinks. There has to be a statute of limitations for that sort of thing, even if both sides admit to exactly what happened. Be reasonable here. "Only political revenge can generate this much interest in a sexual episode"No, the sexual activities of any famous person are of keen interest to the public. Assange is a predatory pig which makes it even more interesting. Political revenge just added some oomph to the press reports, and I'm sure the US was thrilled to 'encourage' Sweden to issue a warrant. As to why she went to the police after making him breakfast, it's simple ... the women found out about each other and realized they were used by a philandering pig. Had he been a decent human being and returned their calls, this probably wouldn't have amounted to anything. Go get em Ladies! This post has been edited by TungstenCarbide:
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anthony |
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QUOTE(TungstenCarbide @ Fri 24th December 2010, 1:31am) As to why she went to the police after making him breakfast, it's simple ... the women found out about each other and realized they were used by a philandering pig. Had he been a decent human being and returned their calls, this probably wouldn't have amounted to anything.
QUOTE The two women who say they were sexually assaulted by the WikiLeaks editor Julian Assange would never have complained to police if he had agreed to take an HIV test, The Mail on Sunday can reveal.
WikiLeaks’s Swedish co-ordinator, who worked closely with Mr Assange for months, said in an exclusive interview that he repeatedly begged his boss to have the test, both to head off the possible police investigation and for Mr Assange’s own peace of mind, given his promiscuous sex life.
‘The two women told me, that if he goes to the clinic for an HIV test, then we won’t go to the police,’ said Mr Assange’s colleague, who wishes to remain anonymous because he is a witness in the case brought by Swedish prosecutors, which led to Mr Assange spending nine days in Wandsworth Prison pending extradition.
QUOTE The WikiLeaks co-ordinator said he felt certain that the two women – who both allege that Mr Assange forced them to have intercourse during the same week in August without using a condom, against their express wishes – had nothing to do with any supposed American intelligence plot to discredit him, as he has frequently claimed.
‘The CIA is not behind this at all,’ he said. ‘Of course it is a golden opportunity for them. But from the beginning, it was personal.’
He said Mr Assange refused to take the test until it was too late, when all the Swedish clinics had closed for the weekend: ‘Julian said, “I don’t like it when people are blackmailing me, and they are blackmailing me by threatening to go to the policeâ€.’
Mr Assange also told him that he had spoken to one of the alleged victims, known as ‘Ms W’, assuring him that ‘she is fine, she won’t go to the police’. The WikiLeaks co-ordinator knew from his own conversations with Ms W that she was not fine at all, but terrified she had been infected.
QUOTE Mr Assange’s British lawyer, Mark Stephens, said his client had taken a test for HIV and other sexually transmitted diseases at a later date, which showed he was not infected. ‘If it is true that all the women really wanted was for him to be tested, and that this would have stopped the case, then it is very disappointing that it has got so far,’ he said. Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13...l#ixzz18zXdtaQlAgain, none of this has been proven. But it paints a picture that makes sense.
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Milton Roe |
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Known alias of J. Random Troll
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QUOTE(anthony @ Thu 23rd December 2010, 7:27pm) QUOTE(TungstenCarbide @ Fri 24th December 2010, 1:31am) As to why she went to the police after making him breakfast, it's simple ... the women found out about each other and realized they were used by a philandering pig. Had he been a decent human being and returned their calls, this probably wouldn't have amounted to anything.
QUOTE The two women who say they were sexually assaulted by the WikiLeaks editor Julian Assange would never have complained to police if he had agreed to take an HIV test, The Mail on Sunday can reveal.
WikiLeaks’s Swedish co-ordinator, who worked closely with Mr Assange for months, said in an exclusive interview that he repeatedly begged his boss to have the test, both to head off the possible police investigation and for Mr Assange’s own peace of mind, given his promiscuous sex life.
‘The two women told me, that if he goes to the clinic for an HIV test, then we won’t go to the police,’ said Mr Assange’s colleague, who wishes to remain anonymous because he is a witness in the case brought by Swedish prosecutors, which led to Mr Assange spending nine days in Wandsworth Prison pending extradition.
QUOTE The WikiLeaks co-ordinator said he felt certain that the two women – who both allege that Mr Assange forced them to have intercourse during the same week in August without using a condom, against their express wishes – had nothing to do with any supposed American intelligence plot to discredit him, as he has frequently claimed.
‘The CIA is not behind this at all,’ he said. ‘Of course it is a golden opportunity for them. But from the beginning, it was personal.’
He said Mr Assange refused to take the test until it was too late, when all the Swedish clinics had closed for the weekend: ‘Julian said, “I don’t like it when people are blackmailing me, and they are blackmailing me by threatening to go to the policeâ€.’
Mr Assange also told him that he had spoken to one of the alleged victims, known as ‘Ms W’, assuring him that ‘she is fine, she won’t go to the police’. The WikiLeaks co-ordinator knew from his own conversations with Ms W that she was not fine at all, but terrified she had been infected.
QUOTE Mr Assange’s British lawyer, Mark Stephens, said his client had taken a test for HIV and other sexually transmitted diseases at a later date, which showed he was not infected. ‘If it is true that all the women really wanted was for him to be tested, and that this would have stopped the case, then it is very disappointing that it has got so far,’ he said. Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13...l#ixzz18zXdtaQlAgain, none of this has been proven. But it paints a picture that makes sense. Any "sense" it makes, should make you ashamed to call "B.S." on anything I've said. Since I've been saying basically this story all along, and getting mostly cat-called for it. Nobody comes out of this looking good, but any woman who screams "rape!" when what she really means is "Gee, I hope I don't have HIV!!" should be charged with perjury and some kind of criminal false accusation. For she has used the law to commit a battery against a man, and she has slandered the man, lied to her society, and (not least) betrayed her fellow women, who'd like to be taken a little more seriously than this kind of story encourages them to be in the future. (IMG: smilys0b23ax56/default/yecch.gif) Cry wolf. Cry BS. But not to me. If you choose to lie down with dogs, I don't want you to think you should use the "remedy" of government police power when you get up with what you're afraid might be fleas. (IMG: smilys0b23ax56/default/hrmph.gif)
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anthony |
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QUOTE(Milton Roe @ Fri 24th December 2010, 3:10am) Any "sense" it makes, should make you ashamed to call "B.S." on anything I've said. Since I've been saying basically this story all along, and getting mostly cat-called for it.
The story you've been saying all along may have included some elements of this, but certainly wasn't this. It is, of course, quite possible that the woman was raped and she initially just wanted him to be tested for HIV. QUOTE(Milton Roe @ Fri 24th December 2010, 3:10am) Nobody comes out of this looking good, but any woman who screams "rape!" when what she really means is "Gee, I hope I don't have HIV!!" should be charged with perjury and some kind of criminal false accusation.
From what I've read, it seems to be the prosecutor who first screamed rape, and the woman merely screamed I woke up to him having sex with me without a condom, which, had Assange not been involved with Wikileaks, would have probably been swept under the rug, but is, nevertheless, rape, if it is proven. If Assange didn't in fact wake Ms. W up to sex without a condom, and she did in fact claim that he did, she should, of course, be "charged with perjury and some kind of criminal false accusation". This post has been edited by anthony:
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Posts in this topic
anthony Sex by surprise Milton Roe
I am trying very hard not to make a joke about W... Lar
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[quote name='Milton Roe' post='261142' date='Tue ... anthony
Gee it was a split condom.
That's the rumor... TungstenCarbide
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[quote name='Milton Roe' post='261147' date='Tue... TungstenCarbide
[quote name='TungstenCarbide' post='261152' date=... Milton Roe
[quote name='Milton Roe' post='261157' date='Tue ... Warui desu
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How old are these Swedish broads, anyway? :ermm:... TungstenCarbide
[quote name='A Horse With No Name' post='261180' ... TungstenCarbide
[quote name='A Horse With No Name' post='261180' ... SB_Johnny
[quote name='A Horse With No Name' post='261180'... anthony
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Woman #2 took the guy home on the train to her a... anthony
Link is given in the posts above.
None of which... anthony
And if that doesn't help, then don't know... GlassBeadGame
And if that doesn't help, then don't kno... Milton Roe
[quote name='Milton Roe' post='261274' date='Wed ... GlassBeadGame
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[quote name='Milton Roe' post='261291' date='Tue ... taiwopanfob Shows how little you know about Burning Man. But e... GlassBeadGame
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I'm curious as to when you assume that consen... TungstenCarbide Woman #2 took the guy home on the train to her app... GlassBeadGame
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Having sex with an unconscious person amounts to... thekohser One thing is for sure, Jimmy Wales would never hav... Ottava I guess he is happy he didn't either pregnant,... anthony On a completely unrelated note :grin: , anyone kn... Lar
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On a completely unrelated note :grin: , anyone ... Lar
[quote name='Lar' post='261287' date='Wed 8th Dec... The Adversary Well...laws on sex are a bit different in Scandina... anthony
And when the females in question didn´t ... GlassBeadGame
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Is there anything here so far which shouldn't... Mr. Mystery Seems he is inclined towards unprotected sex: http... Milton Roe
Seems he is inclined towards unprotected sex: htt... GlassBeadGame
[quote name='Mr. Mystery' post='261817' date='Mon... anthony
Leaving aside the fact that Mr. Assange's per... TungstenCarbide
Julian Assange is an all around piece of shit. Herschelkrustofsky
Julian Assange is an all around piece of shit.
... RMHED
Julian Assange is an all around piece of shit.
... EricBarbour No, just bad enough to be an embarrassment to free... RMHED
...to freedom of speech.
There's no such thi... GlassBeadGame
No, just bad enough to be an embarrassment to fre... dogbiscuit
Assange is a vile animal, plain and simple. He... TungstenCarbide Before this story broke, it was clear that there w... Herschelkrustofsky
Contrast Assange with Michale Moore. Moore's ... TungstenCarbide Contrast Assange with Michale Moore. Moore's b... dogbiscuit
Assange has been celebrated in the press for a lo... RMHED
Wait, I thought we were talking about Assange; w... TungstenCarbide Any "sense" it makes, should make you as... wikieyeay
In my world, if a woman is psychologically devast... anthony
In my world, if a woman is psychologically devas... Milton Roe
[quote name='Milton Roe' post='262880' date='Fri ... anthony
I call BS on that, women get abused by men all t... TungstenCarbide http://www.cnn.com/2012/02/01/world/europe...ange/... thekohser
http://www.cnn.com/2012/02/01/world/europe...ange... EricBarbour Yes, please gents, can you take the healthcare bit... Herschelkrustofsky
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