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Durova Offers "Mentoring" Services |
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LamontStormstar |
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Postmaster
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QUOTE(The Joy @ Thu 20th December 2007, 1:16am) QUOTE(LamontStormstar @ Thu 20th December 2007, 3:13am) That's not as hypocritical as Britney Spears is going to write a book teaching people how to be a good parent. After that Jamie Lynn Spears (Britney's recently pregnant 16 year old sister) is going to write her own book on parenting, too. http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=%22Br...on+parenting%22Hopefully that URL didn't have as s, col or, etc. in it Correction: Britney Spears's mother. Hmm I heard rumors of the kids, too. Well anyway, google says the mother put the book on hold after her 16 year old daughter got pregnant and decided to keep the baby. If you're 16 and pregnant, you can sweep it under a rug with an abortion and your mother will still look like she did a good job, but instead of you decide to have it then your mother looks like she did a terrible job. Hmmm... some cultures say abortion is bad because it kills and other cultures say it's much worse to dishonor your parents.
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AB |
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'...I will be generous and give you a week.'
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QUOTE(Pwok @ Thu 20th December 2007, 11:19pm) I'm climbing off the ceiling. Sorry. They pissed me off when they turned this into a conversation about Britney Spears. It's bad enough to have to see that kind of crap on CNN. But I probably overreacted. That's okay, we love you anyway. {{{Pwok}}} Anyway, if this sort of thing really bothers you, you could just ask the moderators to move the Britney Spears posts over to the lounge. Alternatively, you could start a new thread entitled 'Durova offers "mentoring" services, the non-celebrity discussion', quoting whatever you want to keep from this thread. Both of these are probably easier than trying to explain to people like me why you think Britney Spears is off-topic.
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AB |
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'...I will be generous and give you a week.'
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QUOTE(Moulton @ Fri 21st December 2007, 12:05am) Durova proposed to mentor me after a recent Kafkaesque purge and pogrom. Mercury thought that would be a good idea. The Pogrom Managers did not agree. You are probably lucky, Moulton. Getting mentored by Durova would probably be worse than being banned. Durova is the sort of person who will get a kid kicked out of school, ruining his career dreams, and accuse you of harassment and threaten to throw you in jail if you peaceably and privately protest to her about it. If you want a mentor, try Tony Sidaway or Daniel. SlimVirgin even. Much nicer people. (I know SlimVirgin is controversial, but I actually do think she might be a good mentor for some. Anyway, I like her, at least.) This post has been edited by AB:
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AB |
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'...I will be generous and give you a week.'
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QUOTE(Moulton @ Fri 21st December 2007, 12:52am) And whether she was any good at it or not, Durova did fancy herself as an expert on gaming the system. She even wrote blog articles about it. Oh, she's fantastic at gaming the system. She can harass a person and get them blocked for harassment. Absolutely brilliant! But is that really what you want to learn from a mentor? No, me neither.
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AB |
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'...I will be generous and give you a week.'
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QUOTE(Moulton @ Fri 21st December 2007, 1:38pm) QUOTE(LamontStormstar @ Thu 20th December 2007, 10:27pm) Although, how does Durova harass a person and get them blocked for harassment? I have a theory about how that might be done. When I was engaged in an otherwise congenial e-mail exchange with Durova, she suddenly and unexpectedly declared that she no longer wished to continue our conversation, indicating that she would consider any further traffic to be harrassment. That stance left no room for an expression of perplexity as to what had triggered her dramatic and unexplained reversal. British law disagrees. Sexual content can be harassment. Threats of physical harm can be harassment. Obscenely offencive material - as in, calling someone a Nazi, not just comparing them to a Nazi, but actually saying they are a Nazi - can be harassment. But there is a right of peaceful protest. Peaceful protest is not harassment. Durova was basically threatening you with defamation. It is obscenely offencive, it my view, for her to accuse you of harassment when she is the one making the threats. Actually, calling you a harasser probably is obscenely offencive, and therefore harassment according to British law... if I can just find a case to confirm....
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Moulton |
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Anthropologist from Mars
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Oh, I disagree with Durova, Jim62sch, and the others as well. I am inclined to believe they are merely misinformed and misguided, rather than pathologically misanthropic mendactors of misjudgment. I had hoped that Sheffield Steel would get his wish, but that was not to be (at least not in the original venue of the soap opera). QUOTE(Sheffield Steel @ 20:14, 10 October 2007 (UTC)) Just as at the end of an episode of any good soap opera, I am somewhat interested in seeing what happens next. If Durova can steer Moulton towards productive contributions, I will be very impressed. Sheffield Steel (talk stalk) 20:14, 10 October 2007 (UTC)
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AB |
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'...I will be generous and give you a week.'
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QUOTE(Moulton @ Fri 21st December 2007, 2:52pm) Oh, I disagree with Durova, Jim62sch, and the others as well. I am inclined to believe they are merely misinformed and misguided, rather than pathologically misanthropic mendactors of misjudgment. Durova has gotten a kid kicked out of school, ruining his career dreams. Rather than have any remorse, she considers this to be experience that makes her qualified to deal with similar situations in the future. If you try to explain to her that she hurts people, she will call you condescending, then charge you with spam and harassment. Now, tell me, how do you interpret that as merely misguided? To me, that proves she has absolutely no conscience, no ethics, no basic sense of decency.
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thekohser |
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QUOTE(Moulton @ Fri 21st December 2007, 8:38am) When I was engaged in an otherwise congenial e-mail exchange with Durova, she suddenly and unexpectedly declared that she no longer wished to continue our conversation, indicating that she would consider any further traffic to be harrassment.
I believe this happens shortly after the point that they discover you are their intellectual equal or superior. At that point, their power position is untenable, so they abort the conversation and disengage in a way that suggests any further action on your part will be equated with that of a socially-maladjusted derelict. I got this type of feedback once from Charles Matthews, after I e-mailed him with a reasoned comment that suggested his stubbornly incorrect interpretation of the facts surrounding the Arch Coal fiasco was "some form of mental problem bordering on sociopathy." He replied: "I want to hear nothing more from you. Clear?" End of debate between intellectual equals, I guess. QUOTE(AB @ Fri 21st December 2007, 10:13am) Durova has gotten a kid kicked out of school, ruining his career dreams.
Refresh me on that story with a link, please? Greg This post has been edited by thekohser:
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Disillusioned Lackey |
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QUOTE(thekohser @ Fri 21st December 2007, 9:20am) QUOTE(Moulton @ Fri 21st December 2007, 8:38am) When I was engaged in an otherwise congenial e-mail exchange with Durova, she suddenly and unexpectedly declared that she no longer wished to continue our conversation, indicating that she would consider any further traffic to be harrassment.
I believe this happens shortly after the point that they discover you are their intellectual equal or superior. At that point, their power position is untenable, so they abort the conversation and disengage in a way that suggests any further action on your part will be equated with that of a socially-maladjusted derelict. I got this type of feedback once from Charles Matthews, after I e-mailed him with a reasoned comment that suggested his stubbornly incorrect interpretation of the facts surrounding the Arch Coal fiasco was "some form of mental problem bordering on sociopathy." Durova does this as a standard practice. She did it with Kohs, and I've seen her do it at least two other times. Which given I dont see everything she does all the live long day indicates that she probably does this as a standard modus operandi. And Moulton, your analysis is spot-on. She seeks to annihilate anyone who is her intellectual equal. Anyone less, isn't worth the vitriol. QUOTE(thekohser @ Fri 21st December 2007, 9:20am) QUOTE(AB @ Fri 21st December 2007, 10:13am) Durova has gotten a kid kicked out of school, ruining his career dreams.
Refresh me on that story with a link, please? Greg Oh sweet mother of G-d let this not be true. Does anyone know who this poor soul is? This besides losing Tim H. his post as cong. press office? Sullying his good name? QUOTE(AB @ Fri 21st December 2007, 9:13am) QUOTE(Moulton @ Fri 21st December 2007, 2:52pm) Oh, I disagree with Durova, Jim62sch, and the others as well. I am inclined to believe they are merely misinformed and misguided, rather than pathologically misanthropic mendactors of misjudgment. Durova has gotten a kid kicked out of school, ruining his career dreams. Rather than have any remorse, she considers this to be experience that makes her qualified to deal with similar situations in the future. If you try to explain to her that she hurts people, she will call you condescending, then charge you with spam and harassment.
Now, tell me, how do you interpret that as merely misguided? To me, that proves she has absolutely no conscience, no ethics, no basic sense of decency. Yes, yes, yes. A thousand times yes. QUOTE(AB @ Thu 20th December 2007, 6:44pm) You are probably lucky, Moulton. Getting mentored by Durova would probably be worse than being banned. Durova is the sort of person who will get a kid kicked out of school, ruining his career dreams, and accuse you of harassment and threaten to throw you in jail if you peaceably and privately protest to her about it.
I agree. This post has been edited by Disillusioned Lackey:
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Jonny Cache |
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τα δε μοι παθήματα μαθήματα γÎγονε
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QUOTE(Moulton @ Fri 21st December 2007, 11:04am) QUOTE(Disillusioned Lackey @ Fri 21st December 2007, 10:46am) Moulton, your analysis is spot-on. She seeks to annihilate anyone who is her intellectual equal. Anyone less, isn't worth the vitriol.
In the interests of accuracy in attribution, that was Greg's analysis, not mine. Nonetheless, I have known other instances of that remarkable character trait, which evidently traces back to Cain's jealousy of his more accomplished brother. Hm³, the way I remember the story, it wasn't so much that Abel was more able, per se, merely that he was more favoured by an arbitrary, capricious, and inscrutable authority who didn't like having his caprices questioned. Jonny (IMG: smilys0b23ax56/default/cool.gif) This post has been edited by Jonny Cache:
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Poetlister |
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QUOTE(Jonny Cache @ Fri 21st December 2007, 4:22pm) it wasn't so much that Abel was more able, per se, merely that he was more favoured by an arbitrary, capricious, and inscrutable authority who didn't like having his caprices questioned. Jonny (IMG: smilys0b23ax56/default/cool.gif) You mean ... they had Wikipedia even then? (IMG: smilys0b23ax56/default/ohmy.gif)
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Somey |
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QUOTE(Poetlister @ Fri 21st December 2007, 2:00pm) You mean ... they had Wikipedia even then? (IMG: smilys0b23ax56/default/ohmy.gif) Apparently they had sheep, and keepers of sheep, so I guess that's pretty much the same thing, right? I mean, one might easily interpret Genesis as meaning that God was basically a carnivore, and didn't want to eat vegetables, so when he showed (or "shew") a clear preference for Abel's sheep offering over Cain's vegetable offering, the result was completely predictable. Cain, feeling horribly ripped off, took out his anger on his brother, because God himself could not be effectively attacked. He is (or was), after all, God.Now, admittedly, Cain probably overreacted, but remember, there were only four people in the whole world at that point, so how hard would it have been for God to have given Cain at least some DAP, even if it wasn't all that sincere? Not hard, right? It's not like He had billions of people to show respect to or anything like that. So He was clearly being, well, kind of a jerk. Now, one might ask, what does this have to do with Wikipedia? Or, more specifically, Durova's "mentoring services"? That's the real question here. In a general sense, one might view Cain's reaction to being dissed as similar to that of the WP user who loses an edit war - you have two sides fighting for territory, and more often than not some admin comes along and makes a decision that unfairly favors one side over the other. The losing side is angry, but can't do anything about the admin, who has banning authority, so the next best thing is to attack the other side and try to bring the other user(s) into disrepute, so that they eventually get banned. Durova's intentions by "mentoring" people are, in effect, to prevent them from obtaining what they would consider to be a fair resolution of whatever issue concerns them. Since the only effective means of getting justice on Wikipedia is by sneak attack, following Durova's prescribed behavioral plan (i.e., always be civil, calmly discuss the problem on the talk page, and so on), simply results in further frustration. But from WP's perspective, that's useful because it spreads out the frustration reaction over time, rather than have it all happen in one big flaming incident. I'm rambling, aren't I?
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Disillusioned Lackey |
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QUOTE(Moulton @ Fri 21st December 2007, 10:04am) In the interests of accuracy in attribution, that was Greg's analysis, not mine. Nonetheless, I have known other instances of that remarkable character trait, which evidently traces back to Cain's jealousy of his more accomplished brother.
I thought that was Joshua Zelinsky. (IMG: smilys0b23ax56/default/wink.gif) QUOTE(Pwok @ Thu 20th December 2007, 5:19pm) I'm climbing off the ceiling. Sorry. They pissed me off when they turned this into a conversation about Britney Spears. It's bad enough to have to see that kind of crap on CNN. But I probably overreacted.
Then I'm sure the next month or so of news about her sister Jamie Lynn's pregnancy will upset you a whole lot? I saw it as one of the top 12 hits on Google News today. (IMG: smilys0b23ax56/default/rolleyes.gif)
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