An FT2 Sockpuppet?, It quacks like a duck Options

[guy]

Someone - ideally someone who knows more about it than me - should say something about the major building works that are going to happen with the 'Thameslink' expansion works due to start in a couple of years. As I understand it, the South Eastern service will be diverted elsewhere while the main 'Thameslink' platforms are extended across the river to allow 12 carriages to be used on the route. Lovingboth 08:24, 13 September 2007 (UTC)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Blackfriars_station

Wikipedia ISNOT a crystal ball.

[Kato]

Loveinboth was certainly in the UK this week. It looks like he was doing exactly the same thing as me: Recalling just how bad a snooker player Willie Thorne was, yet Thorne gets to disparage the techniques and shot choices of great players like O'Sullivan and Hendry every April/May on TV. How does that work?

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=...oldid=210530945

[Alex]

It raises the question of what an English editor (LovingBoth) was doing at FT2's place on the East Coast of the US.

Do you know where FT2 is located?

[wikiwhistle]

I cannot say- but I've been told he doesn't want people to know which country he's in sometimes, due to "stalkers"

Other than that, Alex, your guess is as good as mine or you probably know more than I.

This post has been edited by wikiwhistle: Thu 8th May 2008, 1:39pm

[Alex]

I cannot say- but I've been told he doesn't want people to know which country he's in sometimes, due to "stalkers"

Other than that, Alex, your guess is as good as mine or you probably know more than I.

I won't say either, I'm not into this "stalking" business. But FT2 has left no personal information on himself as far as I'm aware, so I can't see it being a problem.

[Miltopia]

I didn't think about this before, but why was Lovingboth even logged in to begin with? His most recent edits with that account were in late April...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contr...ions/Lovingboth

Here's what I think happened: Lovingboth had made some edits before acting as FT2 on the noticeboard, and then once FT2 realized his blunder, he oversighted them. He couldn't oversight the noticeboard comment because there was already a reply and it would make the diff look funny. So the answer I think is yes, he is willing to use abusive oversights (or at least oversights that would make FloFlo say "I BEG YOUR PARDON???" again) to cover his tracks.

[wikiwhistle]

I wonder/assume that the name "lovingboth" means loving both animals and humans?

[Miltopia]

I assumed it was both men and women, since it had posted on some bisexuality topic, the name of which escapes me.

[wikiwhistle]

I assumed it was both men and women, since it had posted on some bisexuality topic, the name of which escapes me.

lol ok my mistake

Looking at this "lovingboth"'s contribs it really would be a piece of acting for this to be FT2, unless he has a side to him we don't often see highlighted. Lovingboth seems very lighthearted in temperament, he reminds me of someone else, not FT2

This post has been edited by wikiwhistle: Thu 8th May 2008, 1:59pm

[Peter Damian]

It raises the question of what an English editor (LovingBoth) was doing at FT2's place on the East Coast of the US.

Do you know where FT2 is located?

Editing patterns are incontrovertibly East coast US. Hence my puzzlement.

[Moulton]

Editing patterns are incontrovertibly East coast US. Hence my puzzlement.

If he happens to be anywhere near Boston, he can come visit me any Saturday afternoon at the Museum of Science, where I will be glad to puzzle him.

[Alex]

It raises the question of what an English editor (LovingBoth) was doing at FT2's place on the East Coast of the US.

Do you know where FT2 is located?

Editing patterns are incontrovertibly East coast US. Hence my puzzlement.

You do realise that people can edit on topics that are not related to their country?

[wikiwhistle]

I cannot say- but I've been told he doesn't want people to know which country he's in sometimes, due to "stalkers"

Other than that, Alex, your guess is as good as mine or you probably know more than I.

I won't say either, I'm not into this "stalking" business.

Nor me, but I also think people are sometimes a bit overly concerned with "stalkers." Though given the number of outings there've been recently, I can now completely understand.

[Peter Damian]

It raises the question of what an English editor (LovingBoth) was doing at FT2's place on the East Coast of the US.

Do you know where FT2 is located?

Editing patterns are incontrovertibly East coast US. Hence my puzzlement.

You do realise that people can edit on topics that are not related to their country?

This is going by average editing times, not by subject. FT2's editing pattern is typical of someone editing US eastern time.

Looking at this "lovingboth"'s contribs it really would be a piece of acting for this to be FT2, unless he has a side to him we don't often see highlighted. Lovingboth seems very lighthearted in temperament, he reminds me of someone else, not FT2

Yes exactly. My initial reaction is they are not the same editor, based on the style, and the content. But what was he doing at FT2's place, and how was he logged in? That is v bizarre.

[edit] oo er missus I see I have just made it into Encyclopedia Dramatica, on the Arbcom page - see under FTZoo - they have quoted my real name as well. Oh well, there goes the neighbourhood.

This post has been edited by Peter Damian: Thu 8th May 2008, 2:21pm

[Docknell]

This seems to show very clearly that TBP is an abusive sock of FT2.

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=...&oldid=26762694

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=...&oldid=26740945

TBP is following the same line as FT2, that all the minor research papers on NLP should be present, whereas HeadlyDown has already shown the reviews of all research (the opinions of qualified scientists who can make sense of all research findings).

TBP’s push for listing all the research on NLP, rather than the reviews, goes as far as to quite the sort of half-truths that FT2 is prone to using

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=...&oldid=26723763

And of course, FT2 later started listing all the separate little research findings on NLP, rather than the overviews from Scientists.

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=...&action=history

Interestingly, Action Potential (Aka Comaze (Comaze.com)) works with a company called Inspiritive, that also lists a huge amount of research supposedly supportive of NLP (since the info was last presented here, Action Potential has removed the web pages, though I have the printscreens)

http://www.inspiritive.com.au/nlp-research/database.htm

Of course, the main reviews of NLP have been left out. It’s a typical pseudoscience tactic designed to appeal to confirmation bias.

So basically, you have TBP (FT2) admitting to being an NLP practitioner. Its not surprising they are all so happy to have the NLP article in such an obscured state. TBP seems also to follow the typical POV forking of “negative views on zoophiles = views on zoosadism”. The cleanup of that article has been so incredibly slow. Its only just recently that the lead section has had the previous NAMBLA-esque conclusion removed

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=...oldid=198041101

Pro-bestiality editors there were very reluctant to lose the “dog-lovers riding into the sunset happy ending” and they kept it there for years.

[Peter Damian]

[replying to Docknell] Tht's VERY serious. There were 3 incidents when FT2 ganged up with other like-minded people on Zoo and NLP articles, basically goading them until they reacted uncivilly, for which they then got indef-blocked. I had always thought this was a case of merely bullying (not that bullying has anything to recommend it). But doing this… Even if the sock is not coming at you at the same time, it multiplies the number of enemies you think you have, and can cause you to blink, and that’s it.

The Arbcom should look at this one again, har har.

[edit]

Your call to "just focus on facts" and "baseline" and "encyclopediac" is one I support, but not in the same way you do. Your idea of these is "I don't want to be bothered with the possibility that there could be merit in both sides' views". You already know what you want the article to say, as witness your selective concept of "neutral reporting". A good call to "focus on facts" covers <u>all</u> facts, good "baseline conclusions" are not predetermined, and a good question right now would be "what is a balanced wiki-neutral view that ''fairly represents all findings''"

.

That is also very damning. Note TBP’s excessive (and grammatically incorrect) overuse of scarequotes, just like his friend.

This post has been edited by Peter Damian: Thu 8th May 2008, 2:35pm

[No one of consequence]

This is getting v puzzling. LovingBoth has a very different edit pattern to FT2, so odds are they are genuinely different people. But then if so, (1) that disproves the whole line of argument that FT2 was making in that very thread. How ironic.

Not really. It depends on how many times Lovingboth and FT2 have edited from the same place vs a different place, and how many times Poetlister et al. edited from the same place and different places.

[Daniel Brandt]

From 2006-07-24 IRC log capture:

FT2` (i=FT2@87.113.13.183.bbplus.pte-ag1.dyn.plus.net) 87.113.13.183 | PLUSNET TECHNOLOGIES LTD * UNITED KINGDOM

appears to be a DSL account in London

Wikiscanner on that Class C

I don't know if this yields any clues.

[Shalom]

From 2006-07-24 IRC log capture:

FT2` (i=FT2@87.113.13.183.bbplus.pte-ag1.dyn.plus.net) 87.113.13.183 | PLUSNET TECHNOLOGIES LTD * UNITED KINGDOM

appears to be a DSL account in London

Wikiscanner on that Class C

I don't know if this yields any clues.

Daniel, check that IP against this one: 58.178.135.242. TBP accidentally signed with that IP address while logged out on October 31, 2005, then logged in to correct it.

I've taken close to an hour to review the contribution logs for editing overlaps and similar interests and habits. It's difficult to come to a conclusion. Having recently challenged FT2 on the Poetlister case, I am in no position to make a neutral statement on an allegation that FT2 may have used a sockpuppet. I would consider forwarding my data to someone else (maybe Proabivouac?) and letting other people handle this.

There are multiple instances where FT2 and TLP edit the same pages within less than 20 minutes of one another. It doesn't prove anything, but it makes me suspicious. I take allegations against a sitting arbitrator very seriously, so out of fairness to him, I will not say more.

[Daniel Brandt]

Daniel, check that IP against this one: 58.178.135.242. TBP accidentally signed with that IP address while logged out on October 31, 2005, then logged in to correct it.

I've taken close to an hour to review the contribution logs for editing overlaps and similar interests and habits. It's difficult to come to a conclusion. Having recently challenged FT2 on the Poetlister case, I am in no position to make a neutral statement on an allegation that FT2 may have used a sockpuppet. I would consider forwarding my data to someone else (maybe Proabivouac?) and letting other people handle this.

There are multiple instances where FT2 and TLP edit the same pages within less than 20 minutes of one another. It doesn't prove anything, but it makes me suspicious. I take allegations against a sitting arbitrator very seriously, so out of fairness to him, I will not say more.

58.178.135.242 appears to be a DSL account in Melbourne, Australia. Don't see him in my IRC logs.
Here's the Class C Wikiscanner.