Hermenauts Unmoored In Semiotic Storms, Toward A Swiss Cheese Infrastructure (SCI) Options

[Jonny Cache]

Moulton mentions several themes that I've mentioned several times myself. Analyzing system dysfunctionalities is one of the things that systems analyzers, designers, engineers, modelers, and theoreticians are supposed to do, so maybe that would be a good thing to think about under this heading.

Gotta run to a meeting …

Jon Awbrey

A couple of generations ago, Marshall McLuhan observed that "the medium is the message".

Behind the mainspace articles at Wikipedia there is the medium of the process in the talk pages, in the policy pages, and in the noticeboard pages.

To my mind, the product is less significant than the process. After all, Wikipedia is hardly the only source of encyclopedic information. But it's one of the best sources of the otherwise hidden processes.

The process is a political one, often erratic, at times contentious and corrosive. For some of us, the process is disappointing, dispiriting, and alienating.

But the saddest part of all is that the manifest dysfunctionality also appears to be hopelessly irremediable.

This post has been edited by Jonny Cache: Thu 15th November 2007, 2:14pm

[Jonny Cache]

Moulton mentions several themes that I've mentioned several times myself. Analyzing system dysfunctionalities is one of the things that systems analyzers, designers, engineers, modelers, and theoreticians are supposed to do, so maybe that would be a good thing to think about under this heading.

A couple of generations ago, Marshall McLuhan observed that "the medium is the message".

Behind the mainspace articles at Wikipedia there is the medium of the process in the talk pages, in the policy pages, and in the noticeboard pages.

To my mind, the product is less significant than the process. After all, Wikipedia is hardly the only source of encyclopedic information. But it's one of the best sources of the otherwise hidden processes.

The process is a political one, often erratic, at times contentious and corrosive. For some of us, the process is disappointing, dispiriting, and alienating.

But the saddest part of all is that the manifest dysfunctionality also appears to be hopelessly irremediable.

I was going to accuse Rue Moulton of wikiplaugerism, but really, it's only Wikipediots who have those kinds of elusions about my ORiginality. Every one of these themes has been harped on, often bluely, and even harpooned on, for many moons, often blue.

Medium/Message

Process/Product

Reality/Popularity

So what can we do to epistem off — this time — Baaabeee !?

Jon Awbrey

This post has been edited by Jonny Cache: Fri 16th November 2007, 2:05pm

[Moulton]

If the manifest dysfunctionality is hopelessly irremediable, then about all I can imagine to do with the lamentable situation is to artlessly croon about it in poignantly vogonic Dithyrambic Vexameter.

[Jonny Cache]

I open my scuttle at night and see the far-sprinkled systems,
And all I see, multiplied as high as I can cipher, edge but
    the rim of the farther systems.

— Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass, p. 81
— Cf. Jon Awbrey, "Differential Logic and Dynamic Systems"

If the manifest dysfunctionality is hopelessly irremediable, then about all I can imagine to do with the lamentable situation is to artlessly croon about it in poignantly vogonic Dithyrambic Vexameter.

No, I have seen a great many systems go belly↑ in φishbowls both practical and theoretical, and sure, we can get some jollies writhing Dunious Elegies to the Dearly Departed or the Gratefully Dead, as the case may be, but there is more to do about their Suite Nadas, and that is to learn from What Went Wrong (W³).

Jon Awbrey

This post has been edited by Jonny Cache: Fri 16th November 2007, 6:00pm

[Moulton]

To my mind, what went wrong is that the current generation of Homo Schleppians once again reprised Humanity's Oldest Logic Error (HOLE) in the process of trying to craft a workable regulatory system.

So, the Powers that Pee have a HOLE in their head.

What else is new under the glum?

[Jonny Cache]

To my mind, what went wrong is that the current generation of Homo Schleppians once again reprised Humanity's Oldest Logic Error (HOLE) in the process of trying to craft a workable regulatory system.

So, the Powers that Pee have a HOLE in their head.

What else is new under the glum?

I have another theory.

Jon Awbrey

[Moulton]

I have another theory.

Cool.

Let's array our respective theories side by side and see if we can NP:Synthesize a functional model of Wikipedia's Woeful Waywardness.

This post has been edited by Moulton: Fri 16th November 2007, 6:27pm

[Jonny Cache]

I have another theory.

Cool.

Let's array our respective theories side by side and see if we can NP:Synthesize a functional model of Wikipedia's Woeful Waywardness.

Zounds Goot !!!

Jonny

[Jon Awbrey]

I open my scuttle at night and see the far-sprinkled systems,
And all I see, multiplied as high as I can cipher, edge but
     the rim of the farther systems.

— Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass, p. 81
— Cf. Jon Awbrey, “Differential Logic and Dynamic Systems”

Summer Re*Runs Already !?

Jon

[GlassBeadGame]

I open my scuttle at night and see the far-sprinkled systems,
And all I see, multiplied as high as I can cipher, edge but
     the rim of the farther systems.

— Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass, p. 81
— Cf. Jon Awbrey, “Differential Logic and Dynamic Systems”

Summer Re*Runs Already !?

Jon

That is an interest quote. I don't believe that science could have known at that time that what Whitman said was true, or was astronomy more advanced at that time than I thought?

[ulsterman]

That is an interest quote. I don't believe that science could have known at that time that what Whitman said was true, or was astronomy more advanced at that time than I thought?

I'm far from clear what Whitman means. If he's saying that there are galaxies going off into the forever then he was out of date. It was a view that was espoused by Kant. However, it was out of fashion in Whitman's time and only revived in the 1920s.