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> Are they all crazy at German Wikipedia?, Wondering after a specific incident
Law Lord
post Sat 19th September 2009, 2:29pm
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(I am posting this here instead of the German forum, since my German is rusty and I prefer an outside view.)

I rarely (never) edit deWiki but a sudden piece of interesting information about the late Hans Diller came to my attention. As far as I could tell, an article on him was only present at deWiki.

I inserted the info (in German). A user reverted. I asked for the reasoning. None was given. It seems said user thought that it is good for the mutual respect that instead of participating in a discussen about an article, you write your admin friends in private and have them threathen anybody you disagree with.

So, asking again made this being entered on my user page:

QUOTE

Please stop your editing without references, which, by the way, looks like „on the wrong side of the enyclopaedic border“. And if you revert that again, I'd have to stop you by efficient means.


The poster was a German administrator, and he has a very anti-French image on his user page.

I posted a request on the bottom of his user page for the removal of said image:
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benutzer_Disk...hateful_content

This led to immidiate reaction by 3 different user, none of them adressing the issue but rather "shooting back" at me. The 3rd one write in German calling me a "troll" and stating I have no interest in "encyclopedic coopoeration" and asking for my immidate block.

Certainly, the culture at deWiki is very different from enWiki.



Any thoughts?

Cheers,
Law Lord
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CharlotteWebb
post Sat 19th September 2009, 2:39pm
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QUOTE(Law Lord @ Sat 19th September 2009, 2:29pm) *

I posted a request on the bottom of his user page for the removal of said image:
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benutzer_Disk...hateful_content

Is it really any more "hateful" than the original?
Image
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Lar
post Sat 19th September 2009, 2:41pm
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QUOTE(CharlotteWebb @ Sat 19th September 2009, 10:39am) *

QUOTE(Law Lord @ Sat 19th September 2009, 2:29pm) *

I posted a request on the bottom of his user page for the removal of said image:
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benutzer_Disk...hateful_content

Is it really any more "hateful" than the original?
Image

I think they're both amusing... far more than hateful. Could just be me.

Perhaps someone who reads Russian could evaluate this one

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:%D0...80%D0%B0%29.svg
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Law Lord
post Sat 19th September 2009, 2:42pm
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Well, the French version makes fun of particular French topics in a way the English does not. I doubt it is something most frWiki users have on the user pages.

Anyway, this is a German user, and he has added a subtext to the image on the user page ... Not sure it is great to make fun of other nationalities like that.
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Law Lord
post Sat 19th September 2009, 2:53pm
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Wow, they are crazy at German wikipedia.

Account blocked indefinitely at 19. September 2009, 14:40 UTC.

For "lack of intent for encyclopaedic cooperation".

Review my entire user contributions (very short) and tell me more. blink.gif

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CharlotteWebb
post Sat 19th September 2009, 3:00pm
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QUOTE(Law Lord @ Sat 19th September 2009, 2:42pm) *

Well, the French version makes fun of particular French topics in a way the English does not. I doubt it is something most frWiki users have on the user pages.

Actually enwiki has all the same commune-stubs. I think Blofeld took care of that years ago. I wouldn't have known Jehovah's "Witnesses" were over-represented on the french site, or geckos for that matter. Learn something new every day...

QUOTE

Anyway, this is a German user, and he has added a subtext to the image on the user page ... Not sure it is great to make fun of other nationalities like that.

Because blood is thicker than skin, or something like that? dry.gif
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Tarc
post Sat 19th September 2009, 3:37pm
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QUOTE(Lar @ Sat 19th September 2009, 10:41am) *
Perhaps someone who reads Russian could evaluate this one


Extremely rusty, but since the the top-left box looks like a phonetic rendition of "Pokemon", and the box under it "meme" now that I look at it, it is probably much the same as the original. Presumably with some alterations to the more Amero-centric entries, i.e. "Putin is teh gay".
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Somey
post Sat 19th September 2009, 3:59pm
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QUOTE(Law Lord @ Sat 19th September 2009, 9:42am) *
Well, the French version makes fun of particular French topics in a way the English does not. I doubt it is something most frWiki users have on the user pages.

I don't want to seem overly sardonic here, but you're not doing this the "Wiki Way."

The Wiki Way demands that you create your own version of the image (or chart or whatever), lampooning the German Wikipedia's content, which (you could say) is mostly comprised of articles about beer, sausages, and really bad Polka music. Then, you get as many French users as possible to display your version on their user pages, until finally one of the Germans notices it (which should take about 45 minutes or so).

Then, of course, rather than simply agree that such things are insulting and remove them from both sites, they would have to "up the ante," probably by creating a userbox template. This would then lead to more templates, insult-categories, attack articles, and so on.

This "tit-for-tat" would then continue for about 15 years or so, until all of the users who started the whole nasty business have left the two sites in question, and the people who came along to replace them finally realize how moronic the whole thing is.
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Jim
post Sat 19th September 2009, 4:10pm
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QUOTE
Wikipedia policy does not allow for blocking (''German: sperren'') of people just because you disagree with them. --


A bold statement, if ever I saw one - if only it were always true... tongue.gif

This post has been edited by Jim: Sat 19th September 2009, 4:12pm
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CharlotteWebb
post Sat 19th September 2009, 4:34pm
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QUOTE(Tarc @ Sat 19th September 2009, 3:37pm) *

Extremely rusty, but since the the top-left box looks like a phonetic rendition of "Pokemon", and the box under it "meme" now that I look at it, it is probably much the same as the original. Presumably with some alterations to the more Amero-centric entries, i.e. "Putin is teh gay".

Litvinenko lives!
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written by he who wrote it
post Sat 19th September 2009, 4:47pm
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QUOTE(Law Lord @ Sat 19th September 2009, 2:42pm) *

Well, the French version makes fun of particular French topics in a way the English does not. I doubt it is something most frWiki users have on the user pages.

Anyway, this is a German user, and he has added a subtext to the image on the user page ... Not sure it is great to make fun of other nationalities like that.

It was created by a French user and is in fact used on a number of French user pages. I don't think it's any more hateful than a non-Anglophone using the original English version.
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Dr. Blofeld
post Sat 19th September 2009, 4:48pm
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I've created an article for you at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hans_Diller

Give German wikipedia a big finger and expand my article on english wikipedia without intervention!!!! evilgrin.gif evilgrin.gif evilgrin.gif
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Law Lord
post Sat 19th September 2009, 5:07pm
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QUOTE(written by he who wrote it @ Sat 19th September 2009, 6:47pm) *

I don't think it's any more hateful than a non-Anglophone using the original English version.


There is the German/French historic dimension, which I think makes it different. Though my point with this thread was not so much the image but rather the user and administrator behaviour towards (rather against) me. I made an edit to an article, which was reverted. I did not re-make it but sought an explanation. Then they blocked me.

QUOTE(Dr. Blofeld @ Sat 19th September 2009, 6:48pm) *

I've created an article for you at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hans_Diller

Give German wikipedia a big finger and expand my article on english wikipedia without intervention!!!! evilgrin.gif evilgrin.gif evilgrin.gif


Absolutely. Just wondering how to appeal blocks on deWiki. Judging from the apparent need for treatment exhibited by at least 2 administrators there, they probably have no unblock procedure. Probably, unblocks are prohibited. rolleyes.gif
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Appleby
post Sat 19th September 2009, 5:42pm
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Just for the record, the original English version is used by User:Ryan4314, who "is not an administrator and does not wish to be one" (alas).
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CharlotteWebb
post Sat 19th September 2009, 7:05pm
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QUOTE(Law Lord @ Sat 19th September 2009, 2:53pm) *

Wow, they are crazy at German wikipedia.

For one amusing measurement of how dewiki and enwiki differ, see [1], [2].
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gomi
post Sat 19th September 2009, 7:20pm
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QUOTE(Somey @ Sat 19th September 2009, 8:59am) *
This "tit-for-tat" would then continue for about 15 years or so, until all of the users who started the whole nasty business have left the two sites in question, and the people who came along to replace them finally realize how moronic the whole thing is.

Somey, Somey ... you must read history. The tit-for-tat would last for 15 years or so, at which time as the German Wikipedia users would begin the secret manufacture of weapons ... for defensive purposes only. The French Wikipedians would build a giant but incomplete wall of defense against the aggression and hostility of the German Wikipedia. At some point another provocation would occur, and the German Wikipedians would all start invading the French Wikipedia, subverting its administrators and banning its minorities. The German Wikipedia would then turn on the English Wikipedia, who would then require help from Simple English Wikipedia to sort things out.

"History doesn't repeat itself, but sometimes it rhymes" -- Mark Twain biggrin.gif

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Law Lord
post Sat 19th September 2009, 9:26pm
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Well, having made 1 minor controversial edit and then asking somebody to remove an image from an user page is not much for an indefinite block. fear.gif

I would appeal but it seems their excellent system for appeal only allow users who are NOT blocked to appeal blocks. laugh.gif
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dtobias
post Sat 19th September 2009, 10:06pm
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Not defending the indef block, which seems like an overreaction on their part, but do you really expect to be treated well when you go onto a project in a language which you apparently either can't or won't speak, do a controversial edit, and then argue in English about it instead of in that project's language (German), while at the same time raising a fuss about allegedly offensive behavior of another user?
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Milton Roe
post Sat 19th September 2009, 10:37pm
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QUOTE(Law Lord @ Sat 19th September 2009, 2:26pm) *

Well, having made 1 minor controversial edit and then asking somebody to remove an image from an user page is not much for an indefinite block. fear.gif

I would appeal but it seems their excellent system for appeal only allow users who are NOT blocked to appeal blocks. laugh.gif

en.wiki was that way for a long time. I suppose it makes sense that de.wiki would continue the fine military tribunal tradition.

The Germans are either at your feet, or at your throat. In this case, you didn't exactly establish dominance right away, did you?
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Gandoman
post Sun 20th September 2009, 10:13am
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The German Wikipedia does have certain cultural differences from the English one. For one, it's more authoritarian. While the English Wikipedia at least attempts to keep up the appearance of assuming good faith, the German one has a policy called Sei grausam ("be horrible"), which says that if someone is out of line, it's better to just come down with the banhammer as quickly as possible. Basically, admins are the bosses, and if someone disagrees with any action performed by an admin or contributor with more seniority, they're likely to get booted real quick.
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