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Posted by: Cock-up-over-conspiracy

Another little example of the Korean Kabal, and their defending admin Future Perfect at Sunrise - aka Dr. Lukas Pietsch of the University of Hamburg Germany - at work on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prostitution_in_South_Korea. Readers might remember how Dr. Lukas Pietsch was accused by another member elsewhere on this forum of favoring some races/nationalities over others.

This was a removal of over 100 references.

• http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Prostitution_in_South_Korea&oldid=253019430.

• http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Prostitution_in_South_Korea&oldid=253176070.

• Diffs; http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Prostitution_in_South_Korea&diff=253176070&oldid=253019430.

With a neat dash of extra chilli from http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Contributions&limit=500&target=Kuebie as a last minute "purification" of any flavor of 'sennen goroshi' finally, thereby reducing the topic back into the state that our Kimchi Warrior http://wikipediareview.com/index.php?act=ST&f=29&t=21847&st=0#entry146740 left in http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Prostitution_in_South_Korea&diff=284114811&oldid=242830036.

At least proving that http://wikipediareview.com/index.php?act=ST&f=29&t=21847&st=0#entry146740 et al are not just anti-Japanese but care enough to engage in a nice bit of Korea-washing whenever they can ... with the collusion of helpful "neutral", policy-following admins too.

Page Pietsch Protected. Now, honest, I could pull another dozen or more Korean or Korea-Japanese topics that have been going through this same, and even more manic, routinue. Does it matter? Does anyone really care?

OK ... nah. I understand. There is just too much of it going on everywhere else to care.

Posted by: Somey

What, prostitution? It's the world's oldest profession, man! Though I should point out that I've never had to resort to... oh, never mind.

Anyway, these "Prostitution in {insert name of country here}" articles are a little excessive in general, don't you think? I mean, half the countries in the world have been made the subjects of these articles, and the other half are just red-links in drop-boxes, waiting for some enterprising national prostitution expert from those countries to fill in. I mean, this is ridiculous - half of these articles are basically guides for sex-starved tourists.

You'll have to forgive me for looking at this in "big picture" terms, Mr. Cock-up... the fact is, these articles should all be trashed. They're culturally insensitive and politically irresponsible, to a degree almost beyond reason - not that that ever stopped Wikipedians before, of course.

Posted by: Cock-up-over-conspiracy

Bad example perhaps but it was more about the issue of the references. And if it is not about the references, what is it about?

(I am assuming Dr Lukas is no expert in South Korea, or any other, prostitution. But I might be wrong).

Have fun applying the same rule to all of them equally I say ...

A hot Korean ... http://www.lovethatkimchi.com/kimchi.jpg

Posted by: Cock-up-over-conspiracy

This is surely a set up, no? ... someone is having a laugh.

This was not me but I would go on record so say that I think guy is a bit of scabby perineum that would not stop at deliberately hurting people or provoking others to then punish them from behind the safety of his Pee-Cee and throws his admin weight around. It all damages the Wikipedia.

It looks like Future Perfect at Sunrise abused his admin powers on someone else and on some other Wikipedian battle front.

For a moment I was tempted to put up a picture of Dr Lukas and an infected perineum so that others might be able to make an academic comparison (as in, half way between a *** and a ***). But, thankfully, even I cannot stoop that low. Use your imagination. Jah wohl, here he is "über Macedonia".

From http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.greek/browse_thread/thread/73049287af7c0822?pli=1 ... and http://groups.google.com/groups/profile?enc_user=i_sZrigAAAAPMCL6ObV1ChKzO7AuHeIr91Yoo39XnMBeJpt4mZ7vpbYgymxJ9X4yX2JEE1l4tVY.

I know nothing about this war. I am not getting involved. It is about Macedonia issues, see http://www.macedoniaontheweb.com/forum/macedonia-news/10134-please-come-wikipedia-talk-concerning-fyrom-minority-greece.html and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Feristos_despoton.

Perhaps this is what the earlier complaint here was about?

Posted by: Somey

This is a fairly common problem with Google Groups - not so much with Yahoo or the purely-social sites, for some reason, though of course it does happen. It just seems like the Google people simply don't give a shit, probably because they can afford not to.

Other sites, meanwhile, can be in a world of hurt if they fail to come down hard on malicious impersonators - and that includes wikis, even WP itself. People don't forget that sort of thing.

Posted by: Cock-up-over-conspiracy

Thank you. Interesting. What I did just see was this ... from the arbcom http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Arbitration_Committee/Noticeboard#Wikipedia:Requests_for_arbitration.2FMacedonia_2.

Why automatically? Why he should not have be re-elected?

So ... so far, in this whole anti-Japanese Caspian blue/Future Perfect at Sunrise debacle, Caspian blue is "edit banned" for 6 months from Japanese related and, elsewhere, Future Perfect at Sunrise is "edit restricted" for one year and desysopped. Wake up folks.

"I told you so" is no compensation at all ... and it does not end here.

I am sure we could all shine a torch into other dark, fetid little corners of the Wikipeda where equal and equivalent operators are lurking.

Its a real pisser when one is forces to go around the arc of attempting to contribute, addressing such matters reasonably, raising the issue at the top, wasting hours of one's life and having one's work trashed, and so on ... only find later have it made obviously clear that you were dealing with twisted sphincters all along.

In Caspian blue's case, there is a trail of other repeat pattern victims. She gets off on it. Apparently so in 'de-sysopped and edit restricted' Dr Lukas Pietsch's case as well.

Posted by: Hipocrite

This is more of the "outing" that this site was created to do, right?

Posted by: Cock-up-over-conspiracy

I'd swop those reading glasses for something capable of taking in a bigger picture. Lukas was out of the Wiki-closet a long time before I found this website.

What do you make of the initial subject?

How many people did Dr Lukas Pietsch, or the others shaft, wasting hours out of their lives, until eventually something had to be done about him? I don't hear you condemning that.

I'd call it making real what the protagonists want to pretend is unreal, bring back it to a human level and applying values ... and what goes around coming back around. Have a read of the original issue, then the consequential evidence. Please, try and keep on topic.

From what I have read of the constructive discussion on this website, one common issue that arises is how anonymity and unaccountability has created a sick environment in which individuals disrespect and abuse each other. Even professionals and academics. Personally, one should apply higher standards and expectations to individuals such as Dr Lukas.

Of course, then there comes a point when one recognizes that "constructive discussion" is futile, cancerous fatigue sets in, and ridicule and satire are inevitable.

If someone treats others like shit ... which is now the 'official view' ... and is then shown to be one themselves, why should not it come back round to bite their butt?

Posted by: seicer

I requested unprotection and it was unprotected. There was no rationale for an indefinite semi-protect, especially given FPAT's controversy.

Posted by: Hipocrite

Bullshit.

Posted by: UseOnceAndDestroy

Nah - http://www.wikipedia-watch.org/hivemind.html#304.

("Outing" is still an absurd term in this context.)

Posted by: seicer

I found this status update rather odd on his Facebook account:

"Nobody dares touch me on wikipedia... HA! I can use my sockpuppet to vandalize articles with impunity because I am an administrator!"

Posted by: Hipocrite

So it's ok to out editors if they are already outed elsewhere, where elsewhere is anywhere else on the internet? Just want to make sure I understand when it's ok to say THEFIERYANGEL IS <<redacted>> without getting banned, or anything, because in the not-so-long-ago there was a special filter that would have made writing "THEFIERYANGEL IS <<redacted>>" change to "THEFIERYANGEL IS BAN ME BAN ME."

Or is this another example where what's good for the goose is terrible for the gander?



That's not his facebook account. Cock-up-over-conspiracy has gone around the internet impersonating <<redacted>>. Is it ok for me to ID Cock-up-over-conspiracy now?

Posted by: Somey

Since the identification originally came from Wikipedia itself, it probably is OK in this case.

Posted by: Hipocrite

citation needed

Posted by: thekohser

Let's see...

Hipocrite provides pithy snipes directed at the creator of the thoughtful content, as well as underlying bitching and moaning about the management of this site's "policy structure".

Cock-up provides insightful commentary, thoughtfully marked-up with color, boldness, links, etc. Lots of value-add for a WR reader like me.

Which pseudonymous character do I value most?

I feel like I'm http://images.google.com/images?q=goofus+and+gallant&sourceid=navclient-ff&rlz=1B3GGGL_enUS291US291&um=1&ie=UTF-8&ei=Z7M2SqGmIqKJtgfH59mrCQ&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&resnum=4&ct=title again, the contrast is so stark and self-explanatory!

Posted by: One

You jumped the shark with this line:

I guess I don't make enough remarks about Kimchi Kommandos who are trying to own articles with their vicious Anglo-military anti-Japanese prejudice by brutally suppressing the fact that so-called "comfort women" were actually all prostitutes who were paid full and fair compensation for their services (because Koreans apparently really like being prostitutes).

Posted by: The Joy

http://www.wikipedia-watch.org/hivemind.html#304

Posted by: Cock-up-over-conspiracy

I clearly and truly stated that it was not me ... it made me think for a moment, and then laugh. Then I discovered the de-sysopping for disrespecting others.

Thank you for importing the unsubstantiated 'shit-throwing' standards (seen above) and One for 'position-twisting' ... which are both perfectly acceptable and common on the Wikipedia ... to wikipediareview.com. Should we have expected any better?

I had no idea Lukas was also embroiled in an assault on Greek history, (ha! I had not even registered Macedonia was a country these days). I have never followed those topics.

Surely, its not "double standards".

Isn't it "leveling the playing field" ... and an excellent thing?

a) Go and make an example by setting some standards on the Wikipedia.
b) It only happens if you act like a perineum ... so don't do that and you are safe.

As a scholar in that field, Dr Lukas should know the definition of the word 'hubris' ...


Ref: Gowy, Jacob Peter. The Fall of Icarus, 1650.

Posted by: Somey

Is this sort of thing really necessary, Mr. Hipocrite? I assume you're just trying to make us all feel bad, but I can assure you, it won't work. Frankly, we feel bad enough just having you as member, half the time...

They haven't even deleted the page:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Requests_for_checkuser/Case/LukasPietsch

Tellyawhut, if they delete that page, I'll seriously consider taking steps to hide Mr. Pietsch's real name in connection with his WP account here on WR, though I should point out that I have little influence over Daniel Brandt these days, so it'll still be on his site. (I actually made http://wikipediareview.com/index.php?s=&showtopic=8352&view=findpost&p=28937 two years ago, I might add.) Still... fair enough?

Posted by: Eva Destruction

That, I'll defend – if LukasPietsch later wants to complain about being hassled by ManiF, he'll want people to be able to see the inappropriate checkuser case.

Posted by: Somey

Admittedly, much of that material is cringe-worthy, and the image above with all the anti-Koreanisms and blood 'n' gore in it may have to go altogether. Still, they have really fast trains in Japan, and I always like good sushi, especially unagi. Yum!


I don't really care one way or the other, but does that page really have to be visible to the public? You'd think they could just undelete it if it ever became necessary. Besides, they both really are his accounts, and ManiF (T-C-L-K-R-D) hasn't edited since December 2006.

Posted by: Cock-up-over-conspiracy

Strong keep: Those are "anti-Koreanism". They are parodies of the language ... often taken literally ... used on the Wikipedia by these 'wee-warriors' still fighting a war that end 64 years ago.

I am not 'anti-Korea' ... I am 'pro-intelligence'. And if intelligence is treated with serial contempt and disrespect, and systemic bias, then I feel empowered to take the piss out of the offenders liberally.

South Korea is not part of 'The Axis of Evil', but many of its men (mainly) are definitely part of 'The Axis of Idiocy' ... and have an appalling attitude towards women.

The actual user page has been deleted, as of 2 May 2009, but an interesting comment remains on the refusal to do a checkuser ... "strong POV on certain issues ... a case of blatant Sockpuppetry in an effort to push a certain POV and create false consensus, in a deliberate disregard to Wikipedia rules" and that was back in 2006. Rien ne change plus ...

Not a point I have ever argued 'One'. Unless you mean the "upwards 1,000,000 women and girls" who were put into service for the Americans during their occupation of the peninsula Post-1945, under the encouragement and collusion of the US Military & Korean government officials, the 1 million said to be active today, or the 2,000 sex workers protesting in Seoul recently that were so keen to whore that they went on a public hunger strike wearing nothing but bikinis and ball masks (... I suspect that just a marketing stunt).

What the records say of Korean women and girls prostituted for the US military is that many of them were tricked, coerced, kidnapped, abused as the victims of hunger, poverty, and war. And they were called comfort women in Korea at least up until the 1970s ... I doubt they "liked" it. Many were the same comfort women that serviced the Japanese. Most survived, a few made a lot of money, many die terrible deaths. They hawked them off to the Japanese, again, during the sex tourism period of the 1970s.

If you are interested in facts, you might also look at how the Korean army treated Vietnamese women (or Southern Korean troups Northern Korean women), whilst they were hired out as mercenaries to the US during the Vietnam War. Kidnapping, rape and murder, and a wake of unwanted orphans. Its all about context.

Whilst the Japanese stopped in 1945, the Americans and Koreans picked up where they left off and industrialized the industry. Today, UN estimates as many as 1.2 million women in South Korea are still engaged to varying degrees in 'sex work' now; many underage, thousands trafficked. It makes the usual accusations of the Japanese, 200,000 etc, look modest.

As one women said, "Our government was one big pimp for the US military" (... for the sake of all that foreign currency).

The Korean YMCA estimates current prostitution to account for 5% of the GDP. More than the industries of forestry, agriculture and fishing COMBINED (4.4%). According to the Korean Institute of Criminology, 20 percent of South Korea adult males, aged between 20-64, purchase sex 4.5 times per month. Probably enough 'vested interest' to buy one a NPOV war on the Wikipedia. Add on top some manic Korean Christians, wiping everything clean, and you have a fine cocktail to deal with.

Seemingly intelligent discussion of these issues, from the point of view of a Korean-American feminist, is just apparently too much to expect on the Wikipedia. You have to appreciate, Korea is nation with huge issues over denial, appalling sexual politics, and government corruption surrounding all this. Now, design a editorial system to manage that ... Unless individuals understand the full context, as might be expected of an academic publication, what else are their edits but partisan propaganda in an information wargame? Try putting any of it past the likes of Caspian blue (... cousin is a nun).

(And, lastly, if you don't know how crazy Koreans get, just remember one, drunken Korean burnt down the country's number one 610-year-old landmark because he was mad at his government ... over something that was his own fault.)

Refs:

Moon, Katharine H. S. 'Sex among Allies: Military Prostitution in US-Korea Relations'.
Lee, Na Young. 'The construction of military prostitution in South Korea during the U.S. military rule, 1945-1948'.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/08/world/asia/08korea.html?_r=3&pagewanted=all


And the trains in Japan run on time too ...

Posted by: Somey

Yeah, but have you ever seen one of those Japanese game shows? Talk about crazy! Then again, I guess you don't want to overlook the Rev. Sun Myung Moon either, really.

Posted by: Cock-up-over-conspiracy

A rough sketch but really an elegant response to Hipocrite and the One above ... And the typically tabloid-esque and binary responses one receives on the Wikipedia, especially from whacko nationalists, if one dares tread on their eggshells and write something "BAD" about that their "GOOD" country.

Yes, it is absolutely true. I wrote a nasty fact about some Koreans and stuck an obviously devious feminist academic or NGO reference after it. Therefore I am 'anti-all-Koreans-throughout-all-history'. Especially the likes of these below. Indeed, I believe that these Koreans are such BAD cases that they should be taken home and spanked vigorously as punishment immediately ...

The above paragraph might read as a bit of a joke ... but in 2004, the United Nations Statistical Commission documented that 44.6% of Korean women experience at least one type of violence in the previous year from their spouses, 15.7% experienced physical violence (defined as kicking, hitting with a fist or objects such as belt or stick and threatening with a knife or similar weapon), 7% sexual violence, statistics regardless of their educational level or occupation.

1. 40% to 60% of married women have been physically abused by their spouse
2. 9% have been beaten badly enough to need medical treatment
3. one out of six married people has suffered from domestic violence
4. the Korean Women’s Hot Line revealed that 42% of those interviewed had been assaulted more than once a week

Hyper-masculinist, military and maladapted Protestant traditions create in Korea a culture where women have been the subject of abuse (obviously even after the Japanese attempts to abolish slavery, female concubines and the two class system on the peninsula).

Of course, if one attempts to develop a picture of any of this, or put into context 20th Century history ...

YOU ARE OBVIOUSLY AN ANTI-KOREAN, RIGHT-WING, JAPANESE, HISTORICAL DENIER AND 2CH TROLL, CONSPIRING IN A PERSONAL ATTACK AGAINST CASPIAN BLUE ... and challenging the combined Asian-Pacific Pro-American forces ... AND YOU MUST BE PUNISHED!!!

Modern Japan has been created and remains a useful distraction for those political, military and male chauvinist elements within Korea that were as happy to whore out Korea women to Japanese, American, Korean or Japanese again (in the 1970s and 80s), as they were to whore with them, themselves ... as long as they were not sleeping with black GIs, of course.

The American military does not want to be reminded of involvement in industrializing Asian prostitution (... and hence my open question about Rlevse's "Asian connection").

Of young Korean women in the sex industry recently surveyed, 29% gave the reason for their involvement as paying for tuition fees, 25% wanted more spending money, 47% said they just wanted to make money quickly. So ... perhaps if they don't enjoy it, it is at least a "nation traditional".

In 2006, the South Korean government handed out gifts for office workers who promised not to visit brothels during Christmas celebrations.

Refs:

Byun, Whasoon. VIOLENCE AGAINST WOMEN AND ITS INDICATORS
Cheng, Sea-ling. ASSUMING MANHOOD: PROSTITUTION AND PATRIOTIC PASSIONS IN KOREA

Posted by: Peter Damian

Look: THIS IS THE TYPE OF ARTICLE THAT SHOULD NOT BE ON WIKIPEDIA AT ALL AND SHOULD BE DELETED ON SIGHT.

Along with all minor blps, articles about sex with animals, sex with children, and the rest of the stuff that belongs in the dustbin.

There is certainly a way of handling subjects like these. But don't let them near Wikipedians. Are we all agreed?

Posted by: Cla68

CU-Conspiracy, what is with you and Korea? Sure, the Korean Kabal exists in Wikipedia, but they aren't nearly as bad as they used to be. The Iranian cabal and a few others are much worse now. I tangled with a few pro-Korean editors a couple of years ago at the Mas Oyama and Apollo Ono articles, but they've since moved on, as well as I. Check out the history of the Sea of Japan article, it's much more calm now than it used to be.

I lived in South Korea for a year a few years ago, which was long enough to see, I think, a lot of the good and bad that goes on there. I've lived off-and-on in Japan for almost nine years now. If you'd like to discuss or debate prostitution in Korea or Japan or any other topic about either of those two countries (the East Sea/Japan Sea, comfort women, Imperial Japanese colonialism, Korea's relationship with the US military, etc), start a thread in one of the off-topic forums. I'd enjoy giving my half-baked opinions on the topics, but I don't think it's that big of a deal as far as Wikipedia is concerned. I guess, though, that we all have our chosen battles.

Posted by: Cock-up-over-conspiracy

Which article? I was painting a broad brush stroke across may be 10 or 20 topics, or more. Do you mean just this article's topic, or the manner in which the topic and editors have been manhandled to date?

Obviously an article on "Prostitution in South Korea" should not read as a 'Howto' or 'Whereto' for sex tourists ... but how to apply such a judgement universally? It would be impossible, would not it?

A problem then arises with the overall asymmetry of administration prejudices and "communal acceptability", arising from a lack of editorial control and qualifications, that comprises the broad cultural bias and aggressive environment present on the Wikipedia ... which is the issue I attempted to raise intelligently.

What I mean, in plain English, is that it might be perfectly "acceptable" and defendable for a number of editors to run a nationalist 'shitsmear' against one country, or a load of boys exclude an alternative feminist critique, but impossible to post single verifiable and relevant "fact" about a small sector within another, without being dragged into full scale ethnic conflicts with users suffering the lack of principles equivalent to a Caspian blue.

Its a farce. Its not fixable.

Posted by: Cla68

Then choose a different battle. "God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change"

Posted by: One

Cock-Up: you're a racist. Your claims to not be racist (followed by sundry racial baiting and racist images) remind me of my racist second cousin. He claims not to have anything at all against black people. Rather, he only hates the "niggers," which he defines as woman-abusing, murderous thugs on the south side of Chicago--not, say, Bill Cosby.

Maybe the Korean Kabal shouldn't be editing these articles, but it's clear that you shouldn't be editing them either.

Move on. You might have good commentary outside your racial fixation.

Posted by: Milton Roe

Devil's advocate question again: Question #1: Do human cultures ever have pathological features? Bearing in mind of course, they such things are only statistical in nature and will never been seen in all members of a given culture? And are likely to be somewhat time-bound (characteristic of a culture more in one era than another)? If so, is pointing such features out, when they occur, "racism?" Can you give a specific example of where it might not be?

Question #2: Is human "race," a valid concept (valid in the same way as "dog breed")? If you think not, then saying anything at all about race (positive or negative) will likely to be viewed as racism. Will cultural criticism, when said culture corresponds fairly well with a given ethnicity, constitute racism? And what about ethnicity itself? Is it valid, but has nothing to do with race? Are there ethnicities which have elements of pathology which may be criticized without racism? Can you give examples which do not involve Caucasians?

Posted by: Somey

Have they ever called you a "Japanese apologist"? Because that's their real problem with you, whether or not you're any of these things. Meanwhile, as for your being a "racist," well... it's not quite the same as racism based primarily on skin color or some bogus notion of "desirable" physical characteristics. In the Far East it's more a kind of tribalism, or more accurately, "Ethnic Nationalism" in which ancestry plays a significant role, but isn't the overriding consideration like it used to be in the US, Europe, or India. (Just don't ask me for a citation on that...)

And while I do think there's ample evidence to suggest that Koreans' hands (even in the South) are decidedly not-so-clean with respect to human rights and women's rights in general, I'm not seeing a lot of subtlety here in your efforts to point those things out, if you know what I'm sayin'.

Posted by: One

Yes, you're right. Not really racism because we're talking about ethnicity rather than races. More like "ethnic nationalism" as Somey says. That said, I consider them akin.

And you also have a good point about demographics; there are differences between cultures, nations, and even races. It's possible to quantify the difference of distributions between groups. Someone publishes a study about ethnicity and IQ, is that racist? Or crime rates in the US? Or the rates of prostitution in Korea? I think calling these things racist would be at least unfair. Some people might have racist motives, but it might be pure observation or even constructive critique.

But with Cock-Up we don't need to guess. Posting agitprop composites of decapitated dogs and Japan-baiting as "just another day in Korea" is not a close case.

Posted by: sbrown

Racism ought to mean treating someone more or less favourably than you otherwise would due to their race. Im 100% against that and I hope everyone here is. In selecting someone for a job you look at the individual and should never say people of his or her race are likely to be less good so I wont choose him or her.

However due to their long history of persecution its only fair to treat say African Americans more favourably. Thus its ok to say that there better (on average) at basketball or sprinting than Americans of European descent. Its not ok to claim (even if you believe the evidence) that there of lower IQ (on average and of course with many exceptions). Thus even if its true (which I very much doubt) that African Americans are on average inherently more prone to some very undesirable trait it would be racist to say so.

Posted by: Cock-up-over-conspiracy

Nothing ... I am talking about a level of editing, a level of consciousness common in many editors.

If I was to make a point, it would be that if "they" (any cabal) become "not as bad", it is only because other unpaid editors have been willing to waste unlimited time out of their life, and risk their reputation, by grinding the cabal's rough and exaggerated edges off in direct conflict. It is designed to keep away good editors who are afraid of having their reputation tarnished leading to precisely what the cabal are seeking to achieve by their tactics; gaining control and lowering the conversation to their propagandic level.

Any sub-culture that is given to corruption, aggression and dishonesty, is at an advance; whilst any sub-culture that is given to submission, reason or reserve, is at a disadvantage ... regardless of the facts.

I am thinking, here, of (non-Japanese) Sennen Goroshi's lengthy engagement with anti-Japanese cabal member Caspian blue. One of a long time of editors who sacrificed his time, and paid for it, until eventually "the community" accepted what had been said all along, topic banned Caspian blue from Japanese articles for 6 months and sent her back to the purgatory of 'Korean food journalism'.

The problem with the moshpit mentality of "the community" in the Japanese-Korean debate, and many other areas is that is it, itself - and its administration - is broadly biased and uninformed from a number of points of view, e.g. racial and sexual.

And, as was shown in Dr. Lukas Pietsch's case, given to the disrespect of others and maliciousness.

Its not about intelligence, its about partisan continuations of war propagandas.

I am not. I tired to develop articles intelligently across a number of areas but gave up a long time ago. The nationalists are bashing topics to suit their idiot agendas. Or let us say, The idiots are bashing topics to suit their nationalist (and sexual) agendas.

Kiddie colors paint the level of debate portrayed as it is ... at comic book level. If I am making a mistake, it is because they are too subtle and complex, and beyond the "Boy's Own" readership that grew up on GI Joe comics.

I am sorry One. I tried to be polite and playful, but you are deliberately fitting blockheadedly into the stereotype and attempting to cause a provocation here ... just like on the Wiki. Is that the truly the best you can do, or do you just not know the subject at hand? Where I come from to call someone a "racist" is very, deeply insulting ignorant behavior.

The problem is with editors like these ... is that they only perceive through their limited mental framework of false dichotomies which decrees anything different from that "limited mental framework" is against it ... anti ... racist ... nationalist etc. Unlike academia, there are no checks, balances or mentoring to ensure the student is thinking outside of their cultural box.

If one does have any national interest in a debate but instead one puts forward a, say, cultural or feminist critique of the events which would equally criticize BOTH sides of a nationalist debate (e.g. both war and the sex industry are abusive crimes against humanity carried out my men in which women are the victims), because this critique does not match their 'limited nationalist mental framework', you are immediately labeled, repelled, attacked or destroyed as "the enemy". "The enemy" according to their framework.


Personally, I abhor nationalism as a concept and as an active principle. It is at a very low level of consciousness. It is used politically for the basest and most rudimentary of agendas, and some of the worst crimes. It is widespread across the Wikipedia.

And its not even possible to engage with these people on the level of copyediting ... by which I am not talking about any 'ethnicity' but a 'level of intelligence' or a lack of ethics that are active broadly across the Wikipedia.

Takeshi Kaneshiro is a Japanese-Chinese (Taiwan) heart-throb widely popular in Korea, ditto Japanese pretty boy band singer Yamashita Tomohisa. Reality is much more complex.

The point made was, who could be "anti-" joyful hotpant wearing hotties like those above? Oh, but they are Korean ...

Posted by: EricBarbour

Posted by: Cock-up-over-conspiracy

I am quite happy to backtrack to posting girlie pictures if that is a more comfortable level for you Eric? Or would you care to expand on your comment?

If I was to raise an issue on some topic that North Korea refugees are discriminated against by South Koreans who look down on them, noting how the labor market offers them less opportunities and pay, how females are exploited by males and forced into the sex industry ... that would not fit so easily into the "anti-Korean" or "racist" box, would it? Can someone be 'anti-South Korea' but 'pro-anti-North Korean discrimination'!?!

So, what is the unspoken rule? Endless 'war games for boys' are OK to fight over but women's issues aren't? We don't want girls spoiling our game?

Posted by: One

...said the user who added a Hitler mustache to some admin's mug.


Not the first such image, nor the craziest. I'm not the only person reminded of Disillusioned Lackey.

Posted by: WikiWatch

Girls spoiling boys http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5ieBG472BtHBhrAbGnu1Ip9njbKww has never been an issue in Japan, until lately.

Posted by: Cock-up-over-conspiracy

Where did my artfully crafted illustration above go?

Yes, a German admin and one employed by Hamburg University too ... (eyes, nose and mustache at 60% opacity, actually).

But, I guess that is the way I feel about historical revisionist and deniers, and anyone that abuse their powers.

Posted by: EricBarbour

I don't give a rat's ass how many girlie piccies you post.
Please, stop harping on the Korean-Japanese article disputes.
Find something else to moan about.

Posted by: Cock-up-over-conspiracy

OK ... I guess I am just about done for just now. Anyway, here is the de-hitlerated, yet still girlified reply.