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> JoshuaZ looks at Section 230, and gives me an idea...
Disillusioned Lackey
post Sun 16th December 2007, 9:12pm
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QUOTE(Somey @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:06pm) *

QUOTE(Disillusioned Lackey @ Sun 16th December 2007, 2:41pm) *
Any new non-profit or private company can hire a registered owner for 200-300 bucks. Not a big deal, nor a scam.

Exactly - it's all strictly legal and above-board. That's the whole point!

If your registered agent is in, say, Delaware (quite common - I believe Wikia's is there), and you're in California or Florida or DC, that really just adds an extra layer of liability protection to your organization, because any legal decision against you is going to have to go through a lot of extra inter-state bureaucracy before it results in any kind of forfeiture of assets. And you have to assume that the registered agent will be located in whatever state provides the most friendly venue for a liability case


Well, if the Registered agents don't forward calls, that would be the end result. But if you wanted to found an LLC, or S-Corporation, all you'd have to do is pay some money to a registered agent, and they'd fill out the papers (they have the certification for this) and you are a "company". Try it! It makes you feel important. Then go edit about our new compand and brag to JeHochman. smile.gif

Having a registered agent is 100% normal, except for that when Wikipedia got anywhere above Sanger and Wales per employees, it was time to outsource the legal to something realistic. The fact that they still have a registered agent is kind of cheesy. Or bad planning. Or (as you guess) subterfuge.

QUOTE(Joseph100 @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:08pm) *

That or find were the servers for wikipeida are located and serve that
service center.

Tech Organization:Wikimedia Foundation, Inc.
Tech Street1:200 2nd Avenue S. #358
Tech Street2:
Tech Street3:
Tech City:Saint Petersburg
Tech State/Province:Florida
Tech Postal Code:33701-4313
Tech Country:US
Tech Phone:+1.17272310101
Tech Phone Ext.:
Tech FAX:+1.17172580207
Tech FAX Ext.:
Tech Email:dns-admin@wikimedia.org


Again - that's their mailing address - the post box. But anyways, the post box should work all the same.
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Daniel Brandt
post Sun 16th December 2007, 9:16pm
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Perhaps Greg Kohs is right — you have to get them on tax evasion if you're going to get their attention at all. That's how they got Al Capone.

QUOTE
But anyways, the post box should work all the same.

Work for what? I started this discussion by talking about a Florida attorney who sent a process server to serve the Foundation. This attorney complained to me that the address was a UPS drop box. You cannot serve a drop box. (This case had nothing to do with me. This attorney contacted me because he thought I may have tried to serve the Foundation at some point in the the recent past, and he wanted to know how I pulled it off. I've never tried to serve the Foundation, and I couldn't help him other than to find that extra address (Jimbo's registered agent address), and refer him to pictures of the staff on the Wikimedia Foundation website, and give him what was Jimbo's residence, which itself may have been out of date.)

Don't you watch gangster movies? The process server has to get real clever to get close enough to serve the bad guy without getting shot by bodyguards, and he also has his buddy close by to witness that the bad guy is actually getting served.
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Moulton
post Sun 16th December 2007, 9:21pm
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QUOTE(Disillusioned Lackey @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:41pm) *
Mike Godwin's Email: mneumonic@well.com

Not quite. He has long used mnemonic@well.com (note the spelling), and he has a brief web page there, but I recently exchanged E-Mail with him at mgodwin@wikimedia.org.

This post has been edited by Moulton: Sun 16th December 2007, 9:22pm
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Joseph100
post Sun 16th December 2007, 9:21pm
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QUOTE(Disillusioned Lackey @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:12pm) *

QUOTE(Somey @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:06pm) *

QUOTE(Disillusioned Lackey @ Sun 16th December 2007, 2:41pm) *
Any new non-profit or private company can hire a registered owner for 200-300 bucks. Not a big deal, nor a scam.

Exactly - it's all strictly legal and above-board. That's the whole point!

If your registered agent is in, say, Delaware (quite common - I believe Wikia's is there), and you're in California or Florida or DC, that really just adds an extra layer of liability protection to your organization, because any legal decision against you is going to have to go through a lot of extra inter-state bureaucracy before it results in any kind of forfeiture of assets. And you have to assume that the registered agent will be located in whatever state provides the most friendly venue for a liability case


Well, if the Registered agents don't forward calls, that would be the end result. But if you wanted to found an LLC, or S-Corporation, all you'd have to do is pay some money to a registered agent, and they'd fill out the papers (they have the certification for this) and you are a "company". Try it! It makes you feel important. Then go edit about our new compand and brag to JeHochman. smile.gif

Having a registered agent is 100% normal, except for that when Wikipedia got anywhere above Sanger and Wales per employees, it was time to outsource the legal to something realistic. The fact that they still have a registered agent is kind of cheesy. Or bad planning. Or (as you guess) subterfuge.

QUOTE(Joseph100 @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:08pm) *

That or find were the servers for wikipeida are located and serve that
service center.

Tech Organization:Wikimedia Foundation, Inc.
Tech Street1:200 2nd Avenue S. #358
Tech Street2:
Tech Street3:
Tech City:Saint Petersburg
Tech State/Province:Florida
Tech Postal Code:33701-4313
Tech Country:US
Tech Phone:+1.17272310101
Tech Phone Ext.:
Tech FAX:+1.17172580207
Tech FAX Ext.:
Tech Email:dns-admin@wikimedia.org


Again - that's their mailing address - the post box. But anyways, the post box should work all the same.



I'm sure you know this already but I have added for the edivication of some
with out this knowledge.



QUOTE
48.081 Service on corporation.--

1. Process against any private corporation, domestic or foreign, may be served:
1. On the president or vice president, or other head of the corporation;
2. In the absence of any person described in paragraph (a), on the cashier, treasurer, secretary, or general manager;
3. In the absence of any person described in paragraph (a) or paragraph (cool.gif, on any director; or
4. In the absence of any person described in paragraph (a), paragraph (cool.gif, or paragraph ©, on any officer or business agent residing in the state.
2. If a foreign corporation has none of the foregoing officers or agents in this state, service may be made on any agent transacting business for it in this state.
3. As an alternative to all of the foregoing, process may be served on the agent designated by the corporation under s. 48.091. However, if service cannot be made on a registered agent because of failure to comply with s. 48.091, service of process shall be permitted on any employee at the corporation's place of business.
4. This section does not apply to service of process on insurance companies.
5. When a corporation engages in substantial and not isolated activities within this state, or has a business office within the state and is actually engaged in the transaction of business therefrom, service upon any officer or business agent while on corporate business within this state may personally be made, pursuant to this section, and it is not necessary in such case that the action, suit, or proceeding against the corporation shall have arisen out of any transaction or operation connected with or incidental to the business being transacted within the state.
History. - s. 8, Nov. 21, 1829; s. 2, Feb. 11, 1834; s. 1, ch. 3590, 1885; RS 1019; GS 1406; s. 1, ch. 6908, 1915; s. 1, ch. 7752, 1918; RGS 2604; CGL 4251; s. 1, ch. 57-97; ss. 1, 2, 3, ch. 59-46; s. 4, ch. 67-254; s. 1, ch. 67-399; s. 6, ch. 79-396; s. 7, ch. 83-216; s. 1, ch. 84-2.
Note. - Former s. 47.17.
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Joseph100
post Sun 16th December 2007, 9:35pm
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QUOTE(Joseph100 @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:21pm) *

QUOTE(Disillusioned Lackey @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:12pm) *

QUOTE(Somey @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:06pm) *

QUOTE(Disillusioned Lackey @ Sun 16th December 2007, 2:41pm) *
Any new non-profit or private company can hire a registered owner for 200-300 bucks. Not a big deal, nor a scam.

Exactly - it's all strictly legal and above-board. That's the whole point!

If your registered agent is in, say, Delaware (quite common - I believe Wikia's is there), and you're in California or Florida or DC, that really just adds an extra layer of liability protection to your organization, because any legal decision against you is going to have to go through a lot of extra inter-state bureaucracy before it results in any kind of forfeiture of assets. And you have to assume that the registered agent will be located in whatever state provides the most friendly venue for a liability case


Well, if the Registered agents don't forward calls, that would be the end result. But if you wanted to found an LLC, or S-Corporation, all you'd have to do is pay some money to a registered agent, and they'd fill out the papers (they have the certification for this) and you are a "company". Try it! It makes you feel important. Then go edit about our new compand and brag to JeHochman. smile.gif

Having a registered agent is 100% normal, except for that when Wikipedia got anywhere above Sanger and Wales per employees, it was time to outsource the legal to something realistic. The fact that they still have a registered agent is kind of cheesy. Or bad planning. Or (as you guess) subterfuge.

QUOTE(Joseph100 @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:08pm) *

That or find were the servers for wikipeida are located and serve that
service center.

Tech Organization:Wikimedia Foundation, Inc.
Tech Street1:200 2nd Avenue S. #358
Tech Street2:
Tech Street3:
Tech City:Saint Petersburg
Tech State/Province:Florida
Tech Postal Code:33701-4313
Tech Country:US
Tech Phone:+1.17272310101
Tech Phone Ext.:
Tech FAX:+1.17172580207
Tech FAX Ext.:
Tech Email:dns-admin@wikimedia.org


Again - that's their mailing address - the post box. But anyways, the post box should work all the same.



I'm sure you know this already but I have added for the edivication of some
with out this knowledge.



QUOTE
48.081 Service on corporation.--

1. Process against any private corporation, domestic or foreign, may be served:
1. On the president or vice president, or other head of the corporation;
2. In the absence of any person described in paragraph (a), on the cashier, treasurer, secretary, or general manager;
3. In the absence of any person described in paragraph (a) or paragraph (cool.gif, on any director; or
4. In the absence of any person described in paragraph (a), paragraph (cool.gif, or paragraph ©, on any officer or business agent residing in the state.
2. If a foreign corporation has none of the foregoing officers or agents in this state, service may be made on any agent transacting business for it in this state.
3. As an alternative to all of the foregoing, process may be served on the agent designated by the corporation under s. 48.091. However, if service cannot be made on a registered agent because of failure to comply with s. 48.091, service of process shall be permitted on any employee at the corporation's place of business.
4. This section does not apply to service of process on insurance companies.
5. When a corporation engages in substantial and not isolated activities within this state, or has a business office within the state and is actually engaged in the transaction of business therefrom, service upon any officer or business agent while on corporate business within this state may personally be made, pursuant to this section, and it is not necessary in such case that the action, suit, or proceeding against the corporation shall have arisen out of any transaction or operation connected with or incidental to the business being transacted within the state.
History. - s. 8, Nov. 21, 1829; s. 2, Feb. 11, 1834; s. 1, ch. 3590, 1885; RS 1019; GS 1406; s. 1, ch. 6908, 1915; s. 1, ch. 7752, 1918; RGS 2604; CGL 4251; s. 1, ch. 57-97; ss. 1, 2, 3, ch. 59-46; s. 4, ch. 67-254; s. 1, ch. 67-399; s. 6, ch. 79-396; s. 7, ch. 83-216; s. 1, ch. 84-2.
Note. - Former s. 47.17.



Some more tradecarft....

Send the Wikifoundation a check for a 5 dollars to this address...
QUOTE
Wikimedia Foundation, Inc.
P.O. Box 919227
Orlando, FL 32891-9227
United States


When the check clears, you will have an address stamped on
back of the check with the name of the wiki treasurer and
thats the target for a good, lawful summons. per Florida statues...

subsection

" 2. In the absence of any person described in paragraph (a), on the cashier, treasurer, secretary, or general manager;"
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Somey
post Sun 16th December 2007, 9:42pm
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QUOTE(Joseph100 @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:35pm) *
When the check clears, you will have an address stamped on back of the check with the name of the wiki treasurer and thats the target for a good, lawful summons. per Florida statues...

Clever! But there's just one problem - once you're gotten the check back from the bank, it's too late to stop it and get the money back...

Think of all the damage they could do with that five bucks!
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Disillusioned Lackey
post Sun 16th December 2007, 9:43pm
Post #47


Unregistered









QUOTE(Daniel Brandt @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:16pm) *

(This case had nothing to do with me. This attorney contacted me because he thought I may have tried to serve the Foundation at some point in the the recent past, and he wanted to know how I pulled it off. I've never tried to serve the Foundation, and I couldn't help him other than to find that extra address (Jimbo's registered agent address), and refer him to pictures of the staff on the Wikimedia Foundation website, and give him what was Jimbo's residence, which itself may have been out of date.)


Why can't you serve a postal address? Just send it with a signature by USPS, or signature FEDEX, and then you have proof they got it. Done. What about the 2nd Avenue North Address? I recall someone salying their po box was around their office, so that sounds ok.
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Joseph100
post Sun 16th December 2007, 9:44pm
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Also some helpful information about wiki...see 990 irs form...

Wiki 990 form - some useful info.
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Disillusioned Lackey
post Sun 16th December 2007, 9:45pm
Post #49


Unregistered









QUOTE(Joseph100 @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:35pm) *
When the check clears, you will have an address stamped on back of the check with the name of the wiki treasurer and thats the target for a good, lawful summons. per Florida statues...


You could also take a stolen credit card, and try to charge 5 cents to the Foundation, to see if the card works.

I hear that's a popular form of "donation" per Danny Wool.
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Joseph100
post Sun 16th December 2007, 9:46pm
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QUOTE(Somey @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:42pm) *

QUOTE(Joseph100 @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:35pm) *
When the check clears, you will have an address stamped on back of the check with the name of the wiki treasurer and thats the target for a good, lawful summons. per Florida statues...

Clever! But there's just one problem - once you're gotten the check back from the bank, it's too late to stop it and get the money back...

Think of all the damage they could do with that five bucks!



True...but is cheaper then hiring a gumshoe or process server..yes.

Any rate, if you do sue, it recoverable costs, if you should win the suit.

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Disillusioned Lackey
post Sun 16th December 2007, 9:50pm
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QUOTE(Joseph100 @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:44pm) *

Also some helpful information about wiki...see 990 irs form...

Wiki 990 form - some useful info.

The only useful info in there is Florence Devouard's address (and what is AE? overseas? Where is France in there), and the address of their paid acountant, who apparently has either an office or a drop box down the street on 2nd avenue from their other two addresses.

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Joseph100
post Sun 16th December 2007, 9:53pm
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QUOTE(Disillusioned Lackey @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:43pm) *

QUOTE(Daniel Brandt @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:16pm) *

(This case had nothing to do with me. This attorney contacted me because he thought I may have tried to serve the Foundation at some point in the the recent past, and he wanted to know how I pulled it off. I've never tried to serve the Foundation, and I couldn't help him other than to find that extra address (Jimbo's registered agent address), and refer him to pictures of the staff on the Wikimedia Foundation website, and give him what was Jimbo's residence, which itself may have been out of date.)


Why can't you serve a postal address? Just send it with a signature by USPS, or signature FEDEX, and then you have proof they got it. Done. What about the 2nd Avenue North Address? I recall someone salying their po box was around their office, so that sounds ok.




See Florida statues on what consistues lawful service of a summons

QUOTE

"(b) If the address provided for the registered agent, officer, director, or principal place of business is a residence or private mailbox, service on the corporation may be made by serving the registered agent, officer or director in accordance with s. 48.031."


S. 48.031 saids this...


QUOTE
48.031 Service of process generally; service of witness subpoenas.--

(1)(a) Service of original process is made by delivering a copy of it to the person to be served with a copy of the complaint, petition, or other initial pleading or paper or by leaving the copies at his or her usual place of abode with any person residing therein who is 15 years of age or older and informing the person of their contents. Minors who are or have been married shall be served as provided in this section.

(b) Employers, when contacted by an individual authorized to make service of process, shall permit the authorized individual to make service on employees in a private area designated by the employer.

(2)(a) Substitute service may be made on the spouse of the person to be served at any place in the county, if the cause of action is not an adversary proceeding between the spouse and the person to be served, if the spouse requests such service, and if the spouse and person to be served are residing together in the same dwelling.

(b) Substitute service may be made on an individual doing business as a sole proprietorship at his or her place of business, during regular business hours, by serving the person in charge of the business at the time of service if two or more attempts to serve the owner have been made at the place of business.

(3)(a) The service of process of witness subpoenas, whether in criminal cases or civil actions, shall be made as provided in subsection (1). However, service of a third degree felony may be made by United States mail directed to the witness at the last known address, and the service must be mailed at least 7 days prior to the date of the witness's required appearance. Failure of a witness to appear in response to a subpoena served by United States mail that is not certified may not be grounds for finding the witness in contempt of court.

(b) A criminal witness subpoena may be posted by a person authorized to serve process at the witness's residence if three attempts to serve the subpoena, made at different times of the day or night on different dates, have failed. The subpoena must be posted at least 5 days prior to the date of the witness's required appearance.

(4)(a) Service of a criminal witness subpoena upon a law enforcement officer or upon any federal, state, or municipal employee called to testify in an official capacity in a criminal case may be made as provided in subsection (1) or by delivery to a designated supervisory or administrative employee at the witness's place of employment if the agency head or highest ranking official at the witness's place of employment has designated such employee to accept such service. However, no such designated employee is required to accept service:

1. For a witness who is no longer employed by the agency at that place of employment;

2. If the witness is not scheduled to work prior to the date the witness is required to appear; or

3. If the appearance date is less than 5 days from the date of service.

The agency head or highest ranking official at the witness's place of employment may determine the days of the week and the hours that service may be made at the witness's place of employment.

(b) Service may also be made in accordance with subsection (3) provided that the person who requests the issuance of the criminal witness subpoena shall be responsible for mailing the subpoena in accordance with that subsection and for making the proper return of service to the court.

(5) A person serving process shall place, on the copy served, the date and time of service and his or her identification number and initials for all service of process.

(6) If the only address for a person to be served, which is discoverable through public records, is a private mailbox, substitute service may be made by leaving a copy of the process with the person in charge of the private mailbox, but only if the process server determines that the person to be served maintains a mailbox at that location.

History.--s. 5, Nov. 23, 1828; RS 1015; GS 1402; RGS 2599; CGL 4246; s. 6, ch. 29737, 1955; s. 4, ch. 67-254; s. 1, ch. 75-34; s. 3, ch. 79-396; s. 3, ch. 82-118; s. 1, ch. 84-339; s. 7, ch. 85-80; s. 2, ch. 87-405; s. 6, ch. 93-208; s. 269, ch. 95-147; s. 1, ch. 95-172; s. 1, ch. 98-410; s. 1, ch. 2004-273.
Note.--Former s. 47.13.


It would appear the simple answer is a summons can be lawfully served, by registered and certified mail to the right person in the corporation in question.
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the fieryangel
post Sun 16th December 2007, 9:56pm
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QUOTE(Disillusioned Lackey @ Sun 16th December 2007, 10:50pm) *

QUOTE(Joseph100 @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:44pm) *

Also some helpful information about wiki...see 990 irs form...

Wiki 990 form - some useful info.

The only useful info in there is Florence Devouard's address (and what is AE? overseas? Where is France in there), and the address of their paid acountant, who apparently has either an office or a drop box down the street on 2nd avenue from their other two addresses.


That's definitely her address in France...You could probably serve Kat Walsh and it would be binding on the foundation....
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Daniel Brandt
post Sun 16th December 2007, 10:00pm
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QUOTE(Disillusioned Lackey @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:43pm) *

Why can't you serve a postal address? Just send it with a signature by USPS, or signature FEDEX, and then you have proof they got it. Done. What about the 2nd Avenue North Address? I recall someone salying their po box was around their office, so that sounds ok.

I feel like a teaching assistant in Real World 101.

What if they pick up their mail at the UPS drop box only once every 12 months? What if the go-fer who picks it up is instructed not to accept anything that requires a signature? How long should you wait before deciding on Plan B, which is to send it to Mr. Godwin? At least if Mr. Godwin starts playing games (which he probably wouldn't do), you're already in the Big League of Fun and Games, instead of sitting around waiting, month after month, for a Return Receipt that will never arrive.

Does the drop box require a picture ID when signing a return receipt, or can the go-fer just sign it, "Thanks idiots — Yours truly, Jayjg"?
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Joseph100
post Sun 16th December 2007, 10:09pm
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QUOTE(the fieryangel @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:56pm) *

QUOTE(Disillusioned Lackey @ Sun 16th December 2007, 10:50pm) *

QUOTE(Joseph100 @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:44pm) *

Also some helpful information about wiki...see 990 irs form...

Wiki 990 form - some useful info.

The only useful info in there is Florence Devouard's address (and what is AE? overseas? Where is France in there), and the address of their paid acountant, who apparently has either an office or a drop box down the street on 2nd avenue from their other two addresses.


That's definitely her address in France...You could probably serve Kat Walsh and it would be binding on the foundation....


see statue 48.081 Service on corporation, Section (2)

QUOTE
"(2) If a foreign corporation has none of the foregoing officers or agents in this state, service may be made on any agent transacting business for it in this state."


In this case the lowly person that cashes the checks for wiki see my other posting regarding the 5 dollar check is qualified to receive lawful service, as an acting agent for the lovely Florenace Devouard.... Also, if she should "visit" the "states" and talk. All the process serve has to do
is to roll in in a ball and toss it to her on stage or dump in her lap for lawful service.



QUOTE(Daniel Brandt @ Sun 16th December 2007, 4:00pm) *

QUOTE(Disillusioned Lackey @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:43pm) *

Why can't you serve a postal address? Just send it with a signature by USPS, or signature FEDEX, and then you have proof they got it. Done. What about the 2nd Avenue North Address? I recall someone salying their po box was around their office, so that sounds ok.

I feel like a teaching assistant in Real World 101.

What if they pick up their mail at the UPS drop box only once every 12 months? What if the go-fer who picks it up is instructed not to accept anything that requires a signature? How long should you wait before deciding on Plan B, which is to send it to Mr. Godwin? At least if Mr. Godwin starts playing games (which he probably wouldn't do), you're already in the Big League of Fun and Games, instead of sitting around waiting, month after month, for a Return Receipt that will never arrive.

Does the drop box require a picture ID when signing a return receipt, or can the go-fer just sign it, "Thanks idiots — Yours truly, Jayjg"?



Some more tradecarft....

Send the Wikifoundation a check for a 5 dollars to this address...
QUOTE
Wikimedia Foundation, Inc.
P.O. Box 919227
Orlando, FL 32891-9227
United States


When the check clears, you will have an address stamped on
back of the check with the name of the wiki treasurer and
thats the target for a good, lawful summons. per Florida statues...

subsection

" 2. In the absence of any person described in paragraph (a), on the cashier, treasurer, secretary, or general manager;"

QUOTE(Joseph100 @ Sun 16th December 2007, 4:08pm) *

QUOTE(the fieryangel @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:56pm) *

QUOTE(Disillusioned Lackey @ Sun 16th December 2007, 10:50pm) *

QUOTE(Joseph100 @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:44pm) *

Also some helpful information about wiki...see 990 irs form...

Wiki 990 form - some useful info.

The only useful info in there is Florence Devouard's address (and what is AE? overseas? Where is France in there), and the address of their paid acountant, who apparently has either an office or a drop box down the street on 2nd avenue from their other two addresses.


That's definitely her address in France...You could probably serve Kat Walsh and it would be binding on the foundation....


see statue 48.081 Service on corporation, Section (2)

QUOTE
"(2) If a foreign corporation has none of the foregoing officers or agents in this state, service may be made on any agent transacting business for it in this state."


In this case the lowly person that cashes the checks for wiki see my other posting regarding the 5 dollar check is qualified to receive lawful service, as an acting agent for the lovely Florenace Devouard.... Also, if she should "visit" the "states" and talk. All the process serve has to do
is to roll in in a ball and toss it to her on stage or dump in her lap for lawful service.



QUOTE(Daniel Brandt @ Sun 16th December 2007, 4:00pm) *

QUOTE(Disillusioned Lackey @ Sun 16th December 2007, 3:43pm) *

Why can't you serve a postal address? Just send it with a signature by USPS, or signature FEDEX, and then you have proof they got it. Done. What about the 2nd Avenue North Address? I recall someone salying their po box was around their office, so that sounds ok.

I feel like a teaching assistant in Real World 101.

What if they pick up their mail at the UPS drop box only once every 12 months? What if the go-fer who picks it up is instructed not to accept anything that requires a signature? How long should you wait before deciding on Plan B, which is to send it to Mr. Godwin? At least if Mr. Godwin starts playing games (which he probably wouldn't do), you're already in the Big League of Fun and Games, instead of sitting around waiting, month after month, for a Return Receipt that will never arrive.

Does the drop box require a picture ID when signing a return receipt, or can the go-fer just sign it, "Thanks idiots — Yours truly, Jayjg"?



Some more tradecarft....

Send the Wikifoundation a check for a 5 dollars to this address...
QUOTE
Wikimedia Foundation, Inc.
P.O. Box 919227
Orlando, FL 32891-9227
United States


When the check clears, you will have an address stamped on
back of the check with the name of the wiki treasurer and
thats the target for a good, lawful summons. per Florida statues...

subsection

" 2. In the absence of any person described in paragraph (a), on the cashier, treasurer, secretary, or general manager;"


or you can ask (though certified mail) the "so called check " be signed for with the summons inside.

This post has been edited by Joseph100: Sun 16th December 2007, 10:10pm
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Moulton
post Sun 16th December 2007, 10:11pm
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I could see filing papers to cease and desist publishing false and defamatory content, etc.

But I can't see filing a suit to recover damages. WMF doesn't have enough money in the bank to run their operation for another year.
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post Sun 16th December 2007, 10:14pm
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QUOTE(Moulton @ Sun 16th December 2007, 4:11pm) *

I could see filing papers to cease and desist publishing false and defamatory content, etc.

But I can't see filing a suit to recover damages. WMF doesn't have enough money in the bank to run their operation for another year.


YOU are wrong, they have assets worth millions.... the Wikipedia.org domain and trademarks as well as computer equipment servers etc.

Thats what you get your judgment from, from the force sale thereof.

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post Sun 16th December 2007, 10:14pm
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QUOTE(GlassBeadGame @ Sun 16th December 2007, 9:08pm) *

QUOTE(Daniel Brandt @ Sun 16th December 2007, 2:52pm) *

QUOTE(anthony @ Sun 16th December 2007, 1:03pm) *

QUOTE(Daniel Brandt @ Thu 13th December 2007, 1:47pm) *

Whoever reads my OTRS will probably be afraid to verify to me that it was received. Does anyone have an address where Mike Godwin would get a registered letter?


I don't have that, but according to Florida Division of Corporations the registered agent for the Foundation is:

CT CORPORATION SYSTEM
1200 S PINE ISLAND RD
PLANTATION FL 33324 US

You have to be kidding. That's almost as good as a P.O. box in the Cayman Islands. I had an attorney from Florida contact me several months ago. He was frustrated because he was trying to serve process on Wikimedia Foundation. He used one address he found, and that didn't work. I gave him another address for the Foundation that I found, and I don't know if that worked. I also gave him an address for Jimbo's residence, and pointed out that Jimbo was on the Board, but he's always traveling and it might be hard to find him, even if that residence address was still accurate.

I had to convince this attorney that as far as I know, there actually is a little office somewhere that's used by Cary Bass and Brion Vibber and (at the time) Carolyn Doran.

I think I'll ask Cade Metz (who interviewed me about SlimVirgin on November 28) for Godwin's telephone, and then call Godwin and ask him directly for 1) a fax number and 2) a street address where he personally is available to sign for registered mail.

About OTRS, I still haven't heard anything from them. How does that thing work? Since I've never seen it work, my impression is that at best, there's a list of emails, and volunteers get to cherry pick the ones they want to handle. The ones that don't get picked end up falling off the edge of the earth. Is that how it works?


USPS certified return receipt requested to the registered agent is sufficient for service Fla.R.Civ.P. 1.070(i)(2)(a) page 18 of the pdf document. If they won't sign for it that will be sufficient cause for a trial court to grant substitute service (usually ordinary mail and posting at the courthouse.) If they then default, good. Yeah, its a pretty mickey mouse way of conducting business.


The whole purpose of having a registered agent is to accept legal process on behalf of a corporation. That's exactly what they're there to do, and they're supposed to be there during normal business hours.

And I can tell you that the current address is new. I think it used to be 200 2nd Avenue S. #358, which seems to be a PO Box. They may have changed it precisely because that Florida Attorney Daniel was talking about got them in trouble for not having a legitimate Registered Agent. Or maybe they changed it because they're moving.

By the way, I heard Godwin is currently in San Francisco. Is the new office already set up there, or is he just helping Jimbo load servers on a truck for Wikia?

UPDATE: the registered agent changed 12/13/2005. Was that before or after your run-in with that attorney, Daniel?

This post has been edited by anthony: Sun 16th December 2007, 10:19pm
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Disillusioned Lackey
post Sun 16th December 2007, 10:17pm
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QUOTE(anthony @ Sun 16th December 2007, 4:14pm) *

By the way, I heard Godwin is currently in San Francisco. Is the new office already set up there, or is he just helping Jimbo load servers on a truck for Wikia?

Or cruising Broadway....
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post Sun 16th December 2007, 10:22pm
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QUOTE(Joseph100 @ Sun 16th December 2007, 5:14pm) *
QUOTE(Moulton @ Sun 16th December 2007, 4:11pm) *
I could see filing papers to cease and desist publishing false and defamatory content, etc.

But I can't see filing a suit to recover damages. WMF doesn't have enough money in the bank to run their operation for another year.
YOU are wrong, they have assets worth millions.... the Wikipedia.org domain and trademarks as well as computer equipment servers etc.

That's what you get your judgment from, from the force sale thereof.

Getting their domain name or trademark is like Verizon getting MCI's domain name and trademark. They are a liability, not an asset.

And any computer gear would be worn out or obsolete by the time any suit comes to fruition.
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