A Parting of Sorts Options

[Ottava]

In a moment of transcendent lucidity while going through Prometheus Unbound, it seemed that Shelley was saying something very important and fundamental. Too often, we cling to a primitive understanding of retributive justice and that we focus only on that. To those who perceive themselves as a victim, they lash out against others and the strongest bounds the other in chains.

However, the true chains are ones we bound ourselves, not Jove's, and it is our clinging to the past transgressions, a desire for retribution, and a hatred for those we feel have wronged us that binds us. Instead, we must lower ourselves to raise ourselves up and we must give up what we feel we deserve. Then, and only then, are we able to rise above it all and attain a better way to live, a harmonious existence that draws us towards the greater truth in the universe. After all, the truest Justice is that all that is physical will come to an end and that without seeking something beyond what was past then you have nothing.

There is something deep inside of us that sympathizes with Shylock and we feel that he was a victim. Instead, the truth is that no form of retribution can have you demand to destroy another simply as retaliation. Work with another, live with another, and exist with another is the only real path.

More often than not, we cannot follow that path. There is something inherent in the Wikis, along with the rest of the world, that blinds us and keeps us from compassion, sympathy, and love. There is something within us that makes us feel that it is easier to hate and wage war than to do what is right.

With that in mind, I'm setting everything aside and I am officially withdrawing my appeal to ArbCom but the outcome was probably the same - banned until 2020 (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/smile.gif). I will stop editing here, editing at the WMF, and focus on completing my dissertation. Will I return after I finish it? Who knows, but right now I don't really care. I wont look here for responses but my email will always be open.

To those who I have wronged, I am sorry for what I have done. To those who I have fought with, who I perceive have wronged me, I apologize and I forgive you for any slight, injury, or transgression that I believe exists.



I'll only say ten more things to keep it short, but I'm sure no one bothered to read beyond the first line anyway. (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/smile.gif)

Somey: Thanks for the hospitality. It was interesting.
Malleus: Stick in there and keep up the good work.
Iridescent: It is sad to see you become like Fritzpol, you were a gem.
A Horse: Maybe one day you'll be allowed back.
Thekohser: Take care and don't have too much fun. (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/smile.gif)
Moulton: Remember that Ugolino della Gheadesca has his justice upon Ruggieri but he is eternally bound to Hell to attain it.
Abd: Good luck.
Guido: Watch out for yourself as best as you can.
Durova: It makes sense why you left.
McBride: Maybe your 3rd admin run will have a better results. (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/smile.gif)

[GlassBeadGame]

DLTDHYITAOTWO.

[Somey]

There is something inherent in the Wikis, along with the rest of the world, that blinds us and keeps us from compassion, sympathy, and love. There is something within us that makes us feel that it is easier to hate and wage war than to do what is right.

Very well stated!

So... which one were you, again? (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/unsure.gif)

[carbuncle]

To those who I have fought with, who I perceive have wronged me, I apologize and I forgive you for any slight, injury, or transgression that I believe exists.

Thanks. Keep away from children.

[Milton Roe]

DLTDHYITAOTWO.

Very good! I got that Jon-esque acronym without even need for a translation.

[Sarcasticidealist]

DLTDHYITAOTWO.

So did I, which suggests to me that it wasn't that Jon-esque at all.

[Milton Roe]

More often than not, we cannot follow that path. There is something inherent in the Wikis, along with the rest of the world, that blinds us and keeps us from compassion, sympathy, and love. There is something within us that makes us feel that it is easier to hate and wage war than to do what is right.

Correct. It is the lack of smilies. (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/biggrin.gif) Which is why they are largely missing on Wikipedia. They really don't want them. Back in the day of Compu$erve, before emoticons as we know them, we had to invent something called a <<grin>>. I have yet to see even this on Wikipedia. There are more barnstars than simple emotions.

Did you know that women smile twice as much as men? Remove smilies from a website, and women notice faster than anybody. Even if they can't put their finger on what's missing.

They didn't call it "Facebook" for nothing, you know. It's all sort of the same thing we're talking about here. (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/tongue.gif)

[melloden]

In a moment of transcendent lucidity while going through Prometheus Unbound, it seemed that Shelley was saying something very important and fundamental. Too often, we cling to a primitive understanding of retributive justice and that we focus only on that. To those who perceive themselves as a victim, they lash out against others and the strongest bounds the other in chains.

...

You couldn't just say "To hell with Wikipedia", now could you? I prefer ragequits to essays.

[Somey]

You couldn't just say "To hell with Wikipedia", now could you? I prefer ragequits to essays.

Well... when you've tried and failed to quit several times before, you instinctively know that you have to quit in such a way that it becomes super-embarrassing to return, or you'll just come back the next day as if nothing had happened.

It still doesn't work in most cases, of course!

[GlassBeadGame]

DLTDHYITAOTWO.

So did I, which suggests to me that it wasn't that Jon-esque at all.

DLTDHYI + 道 + 2

[Somey]

DLTDHYI + 道 + 2

Hey, no fair! You used Unicode! (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/angry.gif)

[Sxeptomaniac]

It appears Ottava may have had an epiphany of some kind. I had thought that he was perhaps perpetually immune to introspection, but I guess anything can change.

[SB_Johnny]

To those who I have fought with, who I perceive have wronged me, I apologize and I forgive you for any slight, injury, or transgression that I believe exists.

Thanks. Keep away from children.

No, I think he should spend more time with children (and their parents).

I might be wrong about this, but it strikes me that over the past few years Ottava has invested far too much time and energy on his virtual life as "Ottava Rima", and neglected his flesh-and-blood life as "just plain old Jeffrey". I think most of us know that being a "Wikimedia person" can drive you absolutely crazy, and I think Ottava has unfortunately let himself fall into that.

I don't think this is necessarily a WMF-related issue though: I think prioritizing your "internet life" over your "real life" will necessarily lead to an unhappy existence, unless interrupted my a moment of sanity (which Ottava seems to have experienced today).

And just for the record: this pretty much disproves the "no-one needs support" theory.

I wish you well, Jeff. You know how to get in touch with me if you need a pal.

[RMHED]

It appears Ottava may have had an epiphany of some kind. I had thought that he was perhaps perpetually immune to introspection, but I guess anything can change.

I had one of those once, but I carried on drinking and it soon went away.

People very seldom change their true nature, I doubt that Ottava has done so.

I know I certainly haven't, I'm an arsehole and will resolutely remain an arsehole despite the occasional messy epiphany.

[Abd]

Abd: Good luck.

Peace be with you.

I was sorry to see you being harassed today. It went beyond any possible reasonable limit. I did what I could to stop it. Not enough, not for today, anyway.

[Abd]

I don't think this is necessarily a WMF-related issue though: I think prioritizing your "internet life" over your "real life" will necessarily lead to an unhappy existence, unless interrupted my a moment of sanity (which Ottava seems to have experienced today).

And just for the record: this pretty much disproves the "no-one needs support" theory.

I wish you well, Jeff. You know how to get in touch with me if you need a pal.

We can join in that, SBJ, I'll return to calling you a jerk tomorrow.

It was very sad for me to find myself needing to confront Ottava over certain things. His parting essay was, in fact, beautiful, and I believe he was sincere about it. Living that out might be difficult. Sure, we are all a-holes, or most of us, at one time or another, but we can also, it's a matter of certainty, rise above it, turn away from it, and, yes, change. Ottava is young, he probably has time. Lots of people change. His essay shows that the seed of change is in him, now it's his job to water it and nurture it.

I will contact him by email and offer any assistance I can give. The problem for him at Wikiversity had nothing to do with his "scholarly work" there, nothing at all. So I hope he can watch it and occasionally contribute, and if he'd like me to watch it for him, I will.

I was going to write to him on his Talk page but realized that it might be misinterpreted. So I was glad to see his essay here.

And those who took the occasion to poke him, shame on you. Really. Enough is enough.

[RMHED]

I don't think this is necessarily a WMF-related issue though: I think prioritizing your "internet life" over your "real life" will necessarily lead to an unhappy existence, unless interrupted my a moment of sanity (which Ottava seems to have experienced today).

And just for the record: this pretty much disproves the "no-one needs support" theory.

I wish you well, Jeff. You know how to get in touch with me if you need a pal.

We can join in that, SBJ, I'll return to calling you a jerk tomorrow.

It was very sad for me to find myself needing to confront Ottava over certain things. His parting essay was, in fact, beautiful, and I believe he was sincere about it. Living that out might be difficult. Sure, we are all a-holes, or most of us, at one time or another, but we can also, it's a matter of certainty, rise above it, turn away from it, and, yes, change. Ottava is young, he probably has time. Lots of people change. His essay shows that the seed of change is in him, now it's his job to water it and nurture it.

I will contact him by email and offer any assistance I can give. The problem for him at Wikiversity had nothing to do with his "scholarly work" there, nothing at all. So I hope he can watch it and occasionally contribute, and if he'd like me to watch it for him, I will.

I was going to write to him on his Talk page but realized that it might be misinterpreted. So I was glad to see his essay here.

And those who took the occasion to poke him, shame on you. Really. Enough is enough.

You're a dumb twat Abd, Ottava's a cunt and will always be so,it's his nature.

[SB_Johnny]

You're a dumb twat Abd, Ottava's a cunt and will always be so,it's his nature.

Ottava has spent the last couple years being an ABD (All But Dissertation) procrastinator. I was in the same spot once upon a time, and I can relate to him in that sense. I dropped out though (and I'm very glad I did), so I'm (thankfully) not an academic now.

Righto about the dumb twat thing. (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/rolleyes.gif)

We can join in that, SBJ, I'll return to calling you a jerk tomorrow.

Should we be lighting candles and singing or something? I'm having a hard time seeing you in a good light, even for a day.

Then again, if you helped Ottava see the light, then at least you're useful for something.

[Milton Roe]

I was going to write to him on his Talk page but realized that it might be misinterpreted. So I was glad to see his essay here.

And those who took the occasion to poke him, shame on you. Really. Enough is enough.

But when is enough, enough? That's ever the question. Ottava invited the vultures. He himself seems to realize that he did something to get himself chained to a rock many a time, foaming and saying egotistical and deliberately provocative things, and (behold) somebody always came along to eat his liverlunch, whenever he did that. That's the way of things in the world. Stealing fire from the gods is a very trollish act. (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/wink.gif)

Our autonomic nervous systems (that most primitive part of us) seem to dispose our emotions into three parts, which coincide generally with states of: [1] feed/fuck (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/evilgrin.gif) [2] fight/flight (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/mad.gif) (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/ohmy.gif) or [3] ignore. (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/mellow.gif) (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/bored.gif) . As the old scuba diver said to me about scuba, there are three basic kinds of stuff in the sea: 1) stuff you can eat, 2) stuff that can eat YOU, and 3) other. That's saying the same thing.

Our heros seem to come in the same three categories, also. There's the stardard Prometheus who is much like Milton's Satan, who rages and foams and suffers and is angry. That's the adrenergic approach to life-- flee, fight, fight, fight. Rage against the dying of the light. Mary Shelley had this Prometheus in mind when she wrote Frankenstein's subtitle: (Or, a Modern Prometheus). Here the scientist steals the fire of life from the gods and becomes locked in a battle of hatred with the monster he creates, then abandons (child abuse and neglect); after the monster kills his brother, his best friend, and finally his wife, he ends up pursuing it endlessly into the arctic in a long chase in the cold that reminds me of the center of Dante's Hell. Nothing BUT fight and flight and revenge and not being able to do anything, because one is trapped in the ice of one's own hatred. And Dr. Frankenstein finally dies doing it, though not without just-a-bit of self insight about freeing himself by helping the ship that rescues him (a non-selfish act in which he can lose himself from his obscession). The monster too, though morally superior, is caught up in the revenge-thing, and finally goes off to kill himself also.

I sometimes think that PB Shelley, right after his wife wrote Frankenstein and he helped her edit it, wrote Prometheus Unbound as a kind of answer to the hellish end of his wife's little gothic novel (which at the time he probably had no idea would eventually become far more famous than anything he would write). PB Shelley's Prometheus has all the positive emotions: faith, hope, charity, love. From the spirit of mankind, which seems also to be a kind of Ode to Joy, Jupiter is overthrown (like those Olympian gods we no longer believe in, in Star Trek), and Hercules is free to unbind Prometheus. A happier ending. And one that Ottava seems to see for himself, in the idea that if one just keeps the faith in positivity, you get pie in the sky when you die. And certainly not Dante's hell, or Prometheus' hell. This is the Jesus myth. Little lamb, who made thee?

But there is a third way that is neither eternally negative, or positive, but... other. Neutral. That is the way of the Buddha, which suggests that we are chained to the rock when we are under the unwilling control of any of our autonomic reponses, and any strong emotions at all. And that the only way to escape from the wheel, or the rock, is to care so little about yourself that you no longer are self-absorbed. When you become engrossed in a difficult problem, or in writing, or in someone else's problems, or any empathetic act, you lose your sense of your own self, and cease to exist, for a bit. And during that time, you are detached, and as truely free as you ever will be.

We've seen a version of that many times in SF. I think I first saw the "bound by your own emotion trap" in Star Trek's The Empath, but you can see it re-done in Star Wars I when Qui-Gon Jinn and Obi-Wan Kenobi fight Darth Maul (okay, nerd alert) and have to pass through a field in which they must suppress emotion to be "unchained." But the Buddha's insight is that this state can be prolonged to any extent you like (ha, you get to be a Vulcan), although you may ultimately pay for failing to take care of yourself when at at last you are forced to re-enter your own life again (that's the Wikipedia/volunteer conundrum, Nerd-o).

So-- philosphically what are we left with, in all of this? Well, nowhere-- if by "somewhere" you mean a place to stay! Nature gave us this nervous system we have, which picks between triune states of being, for a very good reason. It's the product of a half billion years of multicellular evolution, and one cannot simply pick one of three states and decide to live your life there, all the time. That's a recipe for disaster, as things are bound to go badly if you let yourself stay in ANY of the three primary emotional states for very long. Song-of-innocence Little Lamb will meet Tyger, Tyger in the Night of the real world, and probably doesn't get Pie in the Sky, but will become lunch. "I've found that evil usually triumphs, unless good is very, very careful" (Wisdom of Dr. McCoy). Thus, about all I personally can recommend, is more self-awareness about what you're doing, when you're doing it. Neither Prometheus/Satan or Jesus or Buddha have The Answer to how to live your life, if you want to get the most out of it (and retire with your 401k intact, someplace suitably tropical). You must listen to them all.

Ultimately, we're all animals, and there's no escaping that, till we die. At which point, we cease to exist ( (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/tongue.gif) sorry for raining on that parade, but if you don't believe that already, nothing I'm saying is going to change your mind). Personally it's enough for me that human beings will keep growing in power until ultimately we end up with godlike powers, and powers over our primary emotions as well. What we end up doing THEN, is an interesting question. What will be your "will" be, when you end up in control of your will? A man may do as he wills, but he cannot will as he wills, says Schopenhauer (and Lawrence of Arabia, in that great film). But that's only NOW, not in the future when we can write our own source-code. That's mirrors and mirrors and mirrors. Those people in the future are in for interesting times.

So I only suggest (meanwhile) that people try to notice what "state" they're acting from, so that they don't miss anything, and aren't led ENTIRELY by their emotions, as animals and children are. Be human. Try to lose yourself sometimes in other people's problems, instead of your own. And don't forget to smell the roses.

Milton Roe







tl;dr? Well bugger off, then. If you're not interested, then obviously I wasn't writing for YOU.

[EricBarbour]

Yes, Jeff. Smell the roses, finish your degree, and seek gainful employment.

Stop worrying about what Fozzie thinks of you.
Outside of Wikipedia, he is nobody. True of every Arbcommer.