Ethical Management of the English Language Wikipedia, Odd Socracy Tackles Wikipedia's ad hoc Ochlocracy Options Rating

[Moulton]

WAS 4.250 and Moulton have launched a new Learning Project on Wikiversity...

Ethical Management of the English Language Wikipedia

Greg Kohs and Fiery Angel are among the first to sign on. SB Johnny, who is a custodian on Wikiversity, has also signed on.

We are creating a learning resource at WikiVersity.

Please look at Ethical Management of the English Language Wikipedia. You may wish to add your name to the list of human resources. You may wish to contribute to one or more of the items on the to-do list. May we request input on proposed ethical guidelines for management of the English language Wikipedia, or suggestions on a practical objective method of evaluating the same?

[Dzonatas]

One topic to is address is the flow of technological changes that can be done and how to recognize when a technological change is more appropriate over other flows that have lacked such automation. Most actions on the wiki are still handled much by the free flow of text by the act of wiki-edits rather than by technological features that can avoid or reduce the need to wiki-edits in the process of management.

The pragmatic management steps taken by wiki-edits up to this time is evidence of what kind of technological steps that are needed.

[Note to Moulton, 'pragmatic' as in using the experience of the past and determining best cases and outcomes to make future decisions, much like how open source traditionally has developed, or find 'what has been most practical' and then automate it]

Of course, I have a personal agenda to automate/change certain steps in software, so I'll hesitate to add any thesis to the wikiversity page.

This post has been edited by Dzonatas:

[JoseClutch]

WAS 4.250 and Moulton have launched a new Learning Project on Wikiversity...

Ethical Management of the English Language Wikipedia

Greg Kohs and Fiery Angel are among the first to sign on. SB Johnny, who is a custodian on Wikiversity, has also signed on.

We are creating a learning resource at WikiVersity.

Please look at Ethical Management of the English Language Wikipedia. You may wish to add your name to the list of human resources. You may wish to contribute to one or more of the items on the to-do list. May we request input on proposed ethical guidelines for management of the English language Wikipedia, or suggestions on a practical objective method of evaluating the same?

Unless a good contingent of Editors in Good Standing from en.Wikipedia show up, sounds like it'll be a database of banned ideas of heretics.

[Moulton]

Brian McNeil of Wikinews has started a discussion thread on foundation-l about the newly launched project.

Among the posted remarks, I highlight these by Wikiversity custodian SB Johnny, who is also working with us on the new project.

I think it's really important in this case for folks unfamiliar with Wikiversity to hold their fire a bit: this is not the first time that we've had angry, banned Wikipedians come to the project, and so far our track record of preventing Wikiversity from being used as a platform from which to launch attacks on other foundation projects (or any other thing that might be attacked) is 100%.

These guys just arrived 3 days ago, and we're trying to work with them to concentrate on their stated goals (coming up with ethical guidelines that would improve collaborative content creation on websites such as Wikipedia), rather than what they're being distracted by (they use the language of war to describe their situation).

It would really be of help to us if folks could just sit on their hands a bit and let us (the WV custodians and community) do our jobs. In particular, we're trying to keep the "battles" out of the picture, and help them focus on the hard work of teaching-learning-sharing that we've spent the last 2 years learning how to do ourselves. We might even learn more about the possibilities of "learning the wiki way" through their efforts. BUT: we're never going to find out if we don't give them a chance.

Please just give them a month or so to develop this learning resource without interference. The Wikiversity community is very good at exploring possibilities, if nothing else. We're idealists, but not of the dewy-eyed variety, we have a very high ratio of sysopped users to regular contributors, and we even have our own checkusers in case it really gets ugly. We won't allow any harm to come of this, but our scope and policies are radically different from the other WMF wikis, so we're not going to say "no" to things unless they fall outside that (very broad) scope or violate one of our (few) policies.

I've viewed some of the links they've provided, and as much as I wouldn't want any of them dating my sister (or even my third cousin once removed), I'm completely open to the possibility that I could learn something from them, as long as they're given some space to tell their stories without the distraction of constantly having to defend themselves from what they interpret as "attacks".

I encourage anyone who wants to work on this to visit the en.wv custodians on #wikiversity-en (freenode). We're definitely keeping an eye on things, and we're interested in everyone's opinion.

Note that Wikiversity also has a School of Journalism that includes a proposed course entitled Ethics of Journalism.

[Dzonatas]

Looks like the project has its merit recognized.

[Jon Awbrey]

This project on Ethics Anonymous is brought to you by the letters WP:RS.

Jon (IMG:http://wikipediareview.com/stimg9x0b4fsr2/1/folder_post_icons/icon9.gif)

[Milton Roe]

Brian McNeil of Wikinews has started a discussion thread on foundation-l about the newly launched project.

Among the posted remarks, I highlight these by Wikiversity custodian SB Johnny, who is also working with us on the new project.

I encourage anyone who wants to work on this to visit the en.wv custodians on #wikiversity-en (freenode). We're definitely keeping an eye on things, and we're interested in everyone's opinion.

Okay, here's mine. SB Johnny, your idea of your own importance and influence is vastly inflated with respect to reality. Yeah, that's the human condition, but it helps to at least know that.

Consider your own statement:

I think it's really important in this case for folks unfamiliar with Wikiversity to hold their fire a bit: this is not the first time that we've had angry, banned Wikipedians come to the project, and so far our track record of preventing Wikiversity from being used as a platform from which to launch attacks on other foundation projects (or any other thing that might be attacked) is 100%.

If that's true, Mr. Teacher, do you think that's really all YOUR doing?? Might it just possibly be that these banned people coming to you in puzzlement and looking for answers, aren't vandals at all, and never were? And indeed, are most likely people who should not have been banned in the first place?

Really, your pomposity is only exceeded by your ability to kiss WP's ass so they don't start to fear your collection of contributors, and wipe your project off the face of the internet. Yeah, that's the purpose of most of what you're posting here. We got that. Thanks very much.

Now, back to what you were doing. Which wasn't much. (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/tongue.gif)

This post has been edited by Milton Roe:

[the fieryangel]

This project on Ethics Anonymous is brought to you by the letters WP:RS.

Jon (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/cool.gif)

Jonny, you are going to kill me one of these days! I almost chocked to death laughing at that!

Now, I still think that this is going to go down in flames, but I'm trying to take a constructive tack and say that "the core policies should fix all of this. You guys just need to apply them to all editors regardless of seniority". Oh, and I've linked JA's history of the NOR policy....We'll see how well that goes over....

Now, off to the Bastille Day celebrations! Whose head should we chop off today??

This post has been edited by the fieryangel:

[Dzonatas]

I saw a topic on Wikiversity that may be of interest here, Managing vandalism.

[Jon Awbrey]

This project on Ethics Anonymous is brought to you by the letters WP:RS.

Jon (IMG:http://wikipediareview.com/stimg9x0b4fsr2/1/folder_post_icons/icon9.gif)

Jonny, you are going to kill me one of these days! I almost chocked to death laughing at that!

Now, I still think that this is going to go down in flames, but I'm trying to take a constructive tack and say that "the core policies should fix all of this. You guys just need to apply them to all editors regardless of seniority". Oh, and I've linked JA's history of the NOR policy … We'll see how well that goes over …

Now, off to the Bastille Day celebrations! Whose head should we chop off today??

That was just my Subtle Way of suggesting that the Topic introduced here doesn't really rise to the level of a Bard's Eye View, keeping as it does its Head Up The Arse of Wikipediot Arsumptions that remain unexamined by the discussants so far.

I haven't really decided if I care all that much yet, being in a Holiday Mood myself and all, but If and When I do I may move this Utterly Clueless Thread out to the premises of General Discussion, where so many other premisses of Wikipedism pass unreflectively Where Duh Sun Don't Shine.

Jon (IMG:http://wikipediareview.com/stimg9x0b4fsr2/1/folder_post_icons/icon9.gif)

This post has been edited by Jon Awbrey:

[Moulton]

This project on Ethics Anonymous is brought to you by the letters WP:RS.

Jon (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/cool.gif)

And also by Action Research.

[Jon Awbrey]

This project on Ethics Anonymous is brought to you by the letters WP:RS.

Jon (IMG:http://wikipediareview.com/stimg9x0b4fsr2/1/folder_post_icons/icon9.gif)

And also by Action Research.

Yuk … Yuk …

Jon (IMG:http://wikipediareview.com/stimg9x0b4fsr2/1/folder_post_icons/icon9.gif)


This post has been edited by Jon Awbrey:

[Moulton]

Actually, I'm quite serious about that. I didn't really know about Action Research until my neighbor, Jerry Pine, told me about it at the holiday BBQ last Sunday. He has a book on the subject coming out, and it's based in part on the work he did with Susan at Oakland University when he was the Dean of Education there. I've begun to read up on it, and it meshes perfectly with the approach I already had in mind.

[Jon Awbrey]

What's so Φunny, Moulton, is The Very Idea of using words like Ethics In Journalism among people who do not know The First Thing About Ethics In Journalism, to wit, or not, How To Sign Your Real Name To What You Write.

The whole thing starts out Absurd and only gets more Ludicrous the longer you try to keep up the Joke.

Jon (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/cool.gif)

This post has been edited by Jon Awbrey:

[Dzonatas]

[The whole thing starts out Absurd and only gets more Ludicrous the longer you try to keep up the Joke.[/font]

You mean like how a single intern could almost impeach the president over a cigar, but all of the Gautanamo Bay events is of no comparison to the 'evil 'cuban cigar.

This post has been edited by Dzonatas:

[Moulton]

Thing is, Jon, I have two complementary agendas here.

On the one hand, I'd love to imbue some ethics in those who could use an ethical upgrade.

On the other hand, I'm also interested in studying the dynamics of the learning process itself, with special attention to discovering best practices for dealing with learning resistance and learning disabilities.

So this particular learning challenge nicely balances those two sides of the Yin and Yang of it.

[Jon Awbrey]

Thing is, Jon, I have two complementary agendas here.

On the one hand, I'd love to imbue some ethics in those who could use an ethical upgrade.

On the other hand, I'm also interested in studying the dynamics of the learning process itself, with special attention to discovering best practices for dealing with learning resistance and learning disabilities.

So this particular learning challenge nicely balances those two sides of the Yin and Yang of it.

Based on my experience with the system in question, I would have to say that your methods are faulty on both scores. Aside from that, you resist examining in any critical way your initial assumptions about the character of the system that you are dealing with, preferring to stick with a priori notions rather than observing the most obvious data to the contrary. And you have shown me that you are unusually resistant to learning from other people's experience in these matters, so I gave up quite some time ago trying to have any kind of real dialogue with you. Sorry, that's just the way it is.

Jon (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/cool.gif)

This post has been edited by Jon Awbrey:

[Moulton]

I was hoping to give Action Research a spin. Do you expect I will fail at that, too?

[Jon Awbrey]

I was hoping to give Action Research a spin. Do you expect I will fail at that, too?

I suppose that depends on how you go about it.

I can only think of the sorts of things that I had to do in the past when I wanted to learn a new research paradigm, and you don't seem to be doing any of those things.

Jon (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/cool.gif)

This post has been edited by Jon Awbrey:

[Moulton]

Action Research at Wikimedia-Sponsored Projects

Jon, maybe you can persuade Susan to lend a hand...

Here are four recent references to Action Research at Meta-Wiki and Wikiversity...

Developing Wikiversity Through Action Research

Action Research in the Ethical Management of the English Language Wikipedia

Urgent and Emergent Items of Action Research at Meta-Wiki.

Learning Project Linkages at Wikiversity

This post has been edited by Moulton: