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> Tanthalas39 to Wikipedia: Go f**k yourself
wikiwhistle
post Fri 6th March 2009, 7:51pm
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QUOTE(Alison @ Fri 6th March 2009, 7:16am) *

QUOTE(Anonymous editor @ Thu 5th March 2009, 9:21pm) *

Admins are quitting constantly.

I just did ohmy.gif Can't stand it any longer - I just had to get out. Eric Barbour pretty much got it right when he described admin/BLP work as just pushing against an overwhelming tide. And Milton is right in that the individual simply cannot fix the wrongs of the world ...


What was the last straw? Mail me if you prefer.
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Random832
post Fri 6th March 2009, 8:10pm
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QUOTE(wikiwhistle @ Fri 6th March 2009, 7:51pm) *

QUOTE(Alison @ Fri 6th March 2009, 7:16am) *

QUOTE(Anonymous editor @ Thu 5th March 2009, 9:21pm) *

Admins are quitting constantly.

I just did ohmy.gif Can't stand it any longer - I just had to get out. Eric Barbour pretty much got it right when he described admin/BLP work as just pushing against an overwhelming tide. And Milton is right in that the individual simply cannot fix the wrongs of the world ...


What was the last straw? Mail me if you prefer.


How does she know you won't leak it to your buddy Proabivouac?
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EricBarbour
post Fri 6th March 2009, 8:13pm
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QUOTE(Alison)
Eric Barbour pretty much got it right when he described admin/BLP work as just pushing against an overwhelming tide.

I believe my original comment was something like
"bailing out the Pacific Ocean with a teaspoon"........

Sorry you had to quit, Alison. Please don't be tempted
to go back, it won't be any easier or more fun the
second time.
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Son of a Yeti
post Sat 7th March 2009, 8:36am
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QUOTE(EricBarbour @ Fri 6th March 2009, 1:13pm) *

Sorry you had to quit, Alison. Please don't be tempted
to go back, it won't be any easier or more fun the
second time.


But please keep hanging out on WR.

Alison, our postings are always a pleasant read.

smile.gif
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UseOnceAndDestroy
post Sat 7th March 2009, 10:13am
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QUOTE(Random832 @ Fri 6th March 2009, 8:10pm) *

QUOTE(wikiwhistle @ Fri 6th March 2009, 7:51pm) *

What was the last straw? Mail me if you prefer.


How does she know you won't leak it to your buddy Proabivouac?

I couldn't guess what would be worth "leaking" - more likely its an overture to an attempt to recover a dropout to the cult.

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wikiwhistle
post Sat 7th March 2009, 12:23pm
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QUOTE(Random832 @ Fri 6th March 2009, 8:10pm) *

QUOTE(wikiwhistle @ Fri 6th March 2009, 7:51pm) *


What was the last straw? Mail me if you prefer.


How does she know you won't leak it to your buddy Proabivouac?


Cos she knows me a bit. I have never leaked anything to Proab from anyone, also Alison has mentioned on here that she sometimes chats to Proab, so if she wants to say anything to him, she'll say it herself. smile.gif

This post has been edited by wikiwhistle: Sat 7th March 2009, 12:42pm
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Random832
post Sat 7th March 2009, 4:10pm
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QUOTE(wikiwhistle @ Sat 7th March 2009, 12:23pm) *

I have never leaked anything to Proab from anyone,


Sure, pull the other one. rolleyes.gif
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wikiwhistle
post Sat 7th March 2009, 4:17pm
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QUOTE(Random832 @ Sat 7th March 2009, 4:10pm) *

QUOTE(wikiwhistle @ Sat 7th March 2009, 12:23pm) *

I have never leaked anything to Proab from anyone,


Sure, pull the other one. rolleyes.gif


I honestly haven't. You can believe or spread and imply erroneous things about me all you like- but you cannot prove any of your obnoxious claims because they aren't true. Other people have passed on stuff of mine with out my consent, and I wasn't happy about it, but I can see why they wanted to do it, after they already had and I didn't have a choice but to accept it anyway.

I've chatted to him, like a lot of people do at some point, but I never revealed anything of anyone elses' or even of my own, only discussed in a very general way, things that he already knew or seemed to know in precise detail from other sources.

This post has been edited by wikiwhistle: Sat 7th March 2009, 4:18pm
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Alison
post Sat 7th March 2009, 4:22pm
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QUOTE(Random832 @ Sat 7th March 2009, 8:10am) *

QUOTE(wikiwhistle @ Sat 7th March 2009, 12:23pm) *

I have never leaked anything to Proab from anyone,


Sure, pull the other one. rolleyes.gif

This smacks of another, very recent happening here. Oh, delicious irony! rolleyes.gif

Post evidence, Random, or drop it.

QUOTE(wikiwhistle @ Sat 7th March 2009, 4:23am) *

QUOTE(Random832 @ Fri 6th March 2009, 8:10pm) *

QUOTE(wikiwhistle @ Fri 6th March 2009, 7:51pm) *


What was the last straw? Mail me if you prefer.


How does she know you won't leak it to your buddy Proabivouac?


Cos she knows me a bit. I have never leaked anything to Proab from anyone, also Alison has mentioned on here that she sometimes chats to Proab, so if she wants to say anything to him, she'll say it herself. smile.gif

I've spoken with WW in person, and I do know her a bit. And as she points out, I chat with Proab all the time ... so what? rolleyes.gif
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wikiwhistle
post Sat 7th March 2009, 4:29pm
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QUOTE(Alison @ Sat 7th March 2009, 4:20pm) *

QUOTE(Random832 @ Sat 7th March 2009, 8:10am) *

QUOTE(wikiwhistle @ Sat 7th March 2009, 12:23pm) *

I have never leaked anything to Proab from anyone,


Sure, pull the other one. rolleyes.gif

This smacks of another, very recent happening here. Oh, delicious irony! rolleyes.gif

Post evidence, Random, or drop it.


He will find no evidence of my passing on any logs etc or even telling Proab anything he didn't already know, because I have not. He could perhaps try and twist any words of mine to say that, but they will always be able to be read in another way which will be the correct interpretation without someone trying to put a false spin on anything I've said.

I like to think Alison knows that I would never betray anyone's confidence like that, especially another ladies', though I will and have spoken to arbcom and to others who shared my concerns, about things I think think they need to know about other issues, as everyone should to stop people they believe are dodgy. And if I think someone is dodgy and have had a bad experience with them, or know that others have, I will speak out about it in a general way, but that's the right way to go to avoid allowing someone to go on and do the same thing to other people. I personally think that would be failing to do my duty to others and allowing people to possibly have a very unpleasant experience, making me partly responsible for that.

This post has been edited by wikiwhistle: Sat 7th March 2009, 4:35pm
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Sarcasticidealist
post Sat 7th March 2009, 4:36pm
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QUOTE(Alison @ Sat 7th March 2009, 9:22am) *
Post evidence, Random, or drop it.
Per dtobias's beloved [[WP:SAUCE]], I rather feel like I have to echo Alison here, lest I be more of a hypocrite than usual.
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Random832
post Sat 7th March 2009, 4:36pm
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It's all subjective (and therefore you will say entirely worthless), but I will outline my reasons for coming to this belief:

You were the other person involved in attacking Kylu, and the only one of the two who would plausibly have had direct access to the wikichix post that Proabivouac copied here on WR. You were also shockingly unconcerned about his access to such material for someone who had been (and continued to do so even in making light of Proab's access) so condemning of the idea of anyone not in possession of two X chromosomes being able to access the list. I believe the only reasonable explanation for this sudden reversal is if you were the source (and therefore if that were the case, you knew damn well he wasn't going to get anything other than stuff you had no problem sending him and thus saw no cause for concern)

If you were sincere in your claimed belief that Kylu shouldn't have access to wikichix-l (and I believe you were), then your reaction should have mirrored Alison's - or, if anything, been stronger. That it didn't seems to imply that you have an additional piece of information (i.e. that you have control over what material gets forwarded to Proab).

This post has been edited by Random832: Sat 7th March 2009, 4:46pm
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GlassBeadGame
post Sat 7th March 2009, 4:37pm
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QUOTE(Alison @ Sat 7th March 2009, 11:22am) *

QUOTE(Random832 @ Sat 7th March 2009, 8:10am) *

QUOTE(wikiwhistle @ Sat 7th March 2009, 12:23pm) *

I have never leaked anything to Proab from anyone,


Sure, pull the other one. rolleyes.gif

This smacks of another, very recent happening here. Oh, delicious irony! rolleyes.gif

Post evidence, Random, or drop it.

QUOTE(wikiwhistle @ Sat 7th March 2009, 4:23am) *

QUOTE(Random832 @ Fri 6th March 2009, 8:10pm) *

QUOTE(wikiwhistle @ Fri 6th March 2009, 7:51pm) *


What was the last straw? Mail me if you prefer.


How does she know you won't leak it to your buddy Proabivouac?


Cos she knows me a bit. I have never leaked anything to Proab from anyone, also Alison has mentioned on here that she sometimes chats to Proab, so if she wants to say anything to him, she'll say it herself. smile.gif

I've spoken with WW in person, and I do know her a bit. And as she points out, I chat with Proab all the time ... so what? rolleyes.gif


Not that you don't have some very good qualities, Alison, but you are one of the most indiscreet people to ever pass through these parts...and that is saying a whole lot.
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Moulton
post Sat 7th March 2009, 4:48pm
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There are lots of ways to (intentionally or inadvertently) confirm an otherwise unproven assertion without passing the information directly.

Back in the 90s, I was completely in the dark about the role someone (whom I never spoke with in private) had played. So I boldly posted an assertion about her for which I had not a shred of evidence.

She immediately became incensed and demanded to know who had told me that, strongly hinting that it must have been leaked by the single person whom everyone knew was friends with both of us.

I responded that the person who told me was none other than the subject herself, who had confirmed my otherwise ungrounded theory by falsely claiming our mutual friend must have leaked it.

Oddly enough, she never let go of that erroneous indictment, notwithstanding the truth of the matter, that I had just made a good guess and published it as if I knew it for a fact.

It was a little like Claudius in Hamlet becoming visibly shaken when the play-within-a-play exactly mirrors his own nefarious misdeeds. Had Claudius been innocent, the scene would have gone by without him betraying the slightest hint of recognition.
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Random832
post Sat 7th March 2009, 4:51pm
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QUOTE(Moulton @ Sat 7th March 2009, 4:48pm) *

There are lots of ways to (intentionally or inadvertently) confirm an otherwise unproven assertion without passing the information directly.

Back in the 90s, I was completely in the dark about the role someone (whom I never spoke with in private) had played. So I boldly posted an assertion about her for which I had not a shred of evidence.

She immediately became incensed and demanded to know who had told me that, strongly hinting that it must have been leaked by the single person whom everyone knew was friends with both of us.

I responded that the person who told me was none other than the subject herself, who had confirmed my otherwise ungrounded theory by falsely claiming our mutual friend must have leaked it.

Oddly enough, she never let go of that erroneous indictment, notwithstanding the truth of the matter, that I had just made a good guess and published it as if I knew it for a fact.


There is, however, a difference between this and if you had instead published actual words written by her and not intended for your eyes - while what you did only weakly implied a leak, that would confirm it for certain (and only be possible if there had actually been one). It is not in dispute here* that _someone_ leaked / is leaking messages from wikichix-l to Proabivouac (either that, or he somehow gained direct access himself). The only question is who. And the only plausible suspect I can think of is wikiwhistle.

*The possibility remains, I suppose, that the message he posted was a fabrication, but it seems likely someone would have called him on it were that the case

This post has been edited by Random832: Sat 7th March 2009, 4:53pm
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LaraLove
post Sat 7th March 2009, 5:18pm
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QUOTE(Random832 @ Sat 7th March 2009, 11:51am) *

It is not in dispute here* that _someone_ leaked / is leaking messages from wikichix-l to Proabivouac (either that, or he somehow gained direct access himself). The only question is who. And the only plausible suspect I can think of is wikiwhistle.

*The possibility remains, I suppose, that the message he posted was a fabrication, but it seems likely someone would have called him on it were that the case

To be fair, you don't know the member list of Wikichix, so to say "the only plausible suspect I can think of is wikiwhistle" is sort of silly. Only suspect out of whom? Not all chicks on WP are members of this group, and not all members of this group are chicks. It could be any number of people. WW said she didn't do it, Proab says he doesn't have access. That doesn't mean that one of Proab's cronies doesn't have access, pretending to be a female... or that he doesn't have a female crony on the list willing to spill the secrets.

Befriending someone like Proab is, in my opinion, ipso facto support of his actions. So for the sake of his cronies, I hope they've got a sturdy lock on the closet that holds their own skeletons, and no one who knows their secrets willing to spill them.
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Random832
post Sat 7th March 2009, 5:27pm
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QUOTE(LaraLove @ Sat 7th March 2009, 5:18pm) *

...or that he doesn't have a female crony on the list willing to spill the secrets.


Wasn't this precisely my hypothesis? And you're discounting WW's odd non-reaction to his having gotten his hands on a copy of that post.

QUOTE(Alison @ Sat 7th March 2009, 4:22pm) *

This smacks of another, very recent happening here. Oh, delicious irony! rolleyes.gif

The difference is, all my cards are on the table now immediately after someone bothered to actually ask.

This post has been edited by Random832: Sat 7th March 2009, 5:33pm
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Alison
post Sat 7th March 2009, 5:34pm
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QUOTE(LaraLove @ Sat 7th March 2009, 9:18am) *

QUOTE(Random832 @ Sat 7th March 2009, 11:51am) *

It is not in dispute here* that _someone_ leaked / is leaking messages from wikichix-l to Proabivouac (either that, or he somehow gained direct access himself). The only question is who. And the only plausible suspect I can think of is wikiwhistle.

*The possibility remains, I suppose, that the message he posted was a fabrication, but it seems likely someone would have called him on it were that the case

To be fair, you don't know the member list of Wikichix, so to say "the only plausible suspect I can think of is wikiwhistle" is sort of silly. Only suspect out of whom? Not all chicks on WP are members of this group, and not all members of this group are chicks. It could be any number of people. WW said she didn't do it, Proab says he doesn't have access. That doesn't mean that one of Proab's cronies doesn't have access, pretending to be a female... or that he doesn't have a female crony on the list willing to spill the secrets.

Indeed. It could be any of a number of other people that immediately come to mind, actually. I count four of five Chix members on WR right now, with little effort I'd also really like to know who it was who did leak that info, but he ain't tellin' dry.gif
QUOTE(LaraLove @ Sat 7th March 2009, 9:18am) *

Befriending someone like Proab is, in my opinion, ipso facto support of his actions. So for the sake of his cronies, I hope they've got a sturdy lock on the closet that holds their own skeletons, and no one who knows their secrets willing to spill them.

It's not ipso facto anything, any more than posting here is ipso facto support of WordBomb (remember those days?) I don't buy guilt by association at all, sorry.
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LaraLove
post Sat 7th March 2009, 5:38pm
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QUOTE(Random832 @ Sat 7th March 2009, 12:27pm) *

QUOTE(LaraLove @ Sat 7th March 2009, 5:18pm) *

...or that he doesn't have a female crony on the list willing to spill the secrets.


Wasn't this precisely my hypothesis? And you're discounting WW's odd non-reaction to his having gotten his hands on a copy of that post.

I'm not saying it's not WW. I'm saying that it's not clear, and that it's silly to claim she's the only suspect when you don't know who the other possible suspects are.

As far as your evidence goes, I find it compelling, but it's still not proof.
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Random832
post Sat 7th March 2009, 5:38pm
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QUOTE(Alison @ Sat 7th March 2009, 5:34pm) *

Indeed. It could be any of a number of other people that immediately come to mind, actually. I count four of five Chix members on WR right now, with little effort I'd also really like to know who it was who did leak that info, but he ain't tellin' dry.gif

Of those, which others took up the strange position that it is more acceptable for Proabivouac to have access to that material than it is for Kylu?
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