On the matter of Crum375, ....and previous speculation Options

[Piperdown]

here's more speculation. if you'll recall, it has been speculated on WR (and WP) that Crum375 is either a sock of SV or some other of the SV wrecking crew.

i put forth here that Crum375 is neither SV nor Jayjg nor FloNight nor Essjay. A sockpuppet or comeback kid, yes.

i did some cunning linguistic analysis (after paying homage to the Slim Virgin by facing my prayer rug towards Bumfuck, Canada and chanting "The Jimbo, the jayjg, and the slim virgin" 3 times.

my conclusions based on Crum375's rookie fortnight (always a fertile ground for analysis).

- older male (old enough to remember late 1960's sports and computer systems)
- Canadian
- hockey fan
- Toronto
- aircraft pilot
- scuba
- not shy about editing other's user pages (this later causes SV speculation, erroneously)
- 1st week on WP was giving detailed warnings to vandals, citing several policies
- not new to WP in May 2006 when account started.
- chess entusisast
- interests in india, pakistan, viet nam
- medical interests: CAT scan, genome
- interest in Canada/monarchy issues
- not Slim: intro to SV was opposition to her "speedy keep" in AFD of rabbi articles with reasonable, general statement. But:
- 3rd week - kissing FloNight, SV ass over "harassment", wikifying "holcaust denier" & "anti-semitic" claims by Berlet in Daniel Brandt article, editing "jews and their lies" article. He's made wikifriends with slim and nurse flo, for wikilife. for better or for worse.
- not jayjg: called bullshit on j-man by countering Jayjg on his altering AFD discussions.

- later adminned: nominated by the cunning Musical Linguist, crowned by Essjay, and congratulated by Slimmy, all within 10 minutes of each other. They were all quite chummy by Feb 2007.

Now Crummy is relegated to an SPA account. That purpose being holding down the fort for the Team Slim.

Question is, who was Crummy before (and probably after too) May 2006?

This post has been edited by Piperdown: Fri 2nd November 2007, 2:06am

[Kato]

I spent ages matching diffs on WikiAbuse to conclude that the accusations about Crum and SV were false, but the site got removed, and the rumour resurfaced much to my ire.

Crum ain't no sockpuppet of anyone but Crum.

But this damn rumour keeps coming up.

[blissyu2]

He certainly does SlimVirgin's bidding at a whim. In Wikipedia lingo, that makes them a sock puppet. As much of a sock puppet as many of the people who are falsely accused. But they don't seem to be the same person. Just another person who is willing to go out to bat for SV.

[guy]

He certainly does SlimVirgin's bidding at a whim. In Wikipedia lingo, that makes them a sock puppet.

There is the term meat puppet, but it seems to be synonymous with sock puppet when it suits people.

[blissyu2]

He certainly does SlimVirgin's bidding at a whim. In Wikipedia lingo, that makes them a sock puppet.

There is the term meat puppet, but it seems to be synonymous with sock puppet when it suits people.

What we can see is that:

1) Whenever SlimVirgin needs a hand, she doesn't even have to ask, and magically Crum375 is there.
2) If ever SlimVirgin needs protecting, she doesn't even have to ask, and magically Crum375 knows.
3) If ever SlimVirgin can't do something because of a conflict of interest, Crum375 will do it.

They seem to have a kind of parasitic relationship, whereby Crum375 feeds off SlimVirgin's good name to get power for himself, and he will do anything picking her nits doing whatever for her to further his own ambitions.

As for them being the same person, its just too obvious. If they are both you, you'd get them to fight a bit surely. I mean its possible, if nothing else is known, but I think given SlimVirgin's history and how she does things (knight in shining armour/damsel in distress routine) its just that Crum375 has gamed the system better than SlimVirgin's other knights.

[Yehudi]

Looks to me like a close meatpuppet relationship. No doubt they're in contact by e-mail, IM, maybe even telephone.

[Aloft]

I doubt Crum is a sock or reincarnation. It's possible, but I haven't seen anything that makes me think it's likely.

Musical Linguist is the one that nominated him for adminship, so naturally he's still playing her lapdog after she changed to ElinorD.

Here's an interesting diff for you, though:
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=...&oldid=55362982
I doubt a reincarnated user would make that mistake.

Further reading: http://millosh.wordpress.com/2007/10/22/wo...ojects-crum375/

And an interesting comment by SlimVirgin: http://millosh.wordpress.com/2007/10/18/wo...cts-slimvirgin/

We need a top-down decision to create a more civil community, with zero tolerance of stalking and harassment, and with much less tolerance of the dominant teenage white boy culture, which is simply driving women and older men away.

This explains Jimbo's recent participation in the War On Harassment. He's under pressure from his devoted users, who refuse to contribute unless he defends them from all the people they've pissed off over the years.

This post has been edited by Aloft: Fri 2nd November 2007, 3:53pm

[blissyu2]

Looks to me like a close meatpuppet relationship. No doubt they're in contact by e-mail, IM, maybe even telephone.

Not necessarily. SlimVirgin is somewhat predictable. He could simply be doing what he knows she would want him to do.

[yow]

I had maybe 5 or 6 minor and very diverse, non-troll, non-vandal edits, over a period of some weeks, on my latest Wikipedia account. I just made SUCH a nice page for Swalwell, Alberta; intentionally as unobjectionable and bland and normal as possible; using all the proper templates and categories and Lat-Long coordinates. It was like the page for any other "hamlet" in Alberta (hamlets seem to be 500> people or so), a lot like the page for this hamlet, for example. Minimal, truthful, informative, using Canadian government data. It was OK for 24 hours, but then Crum375 deleted it as "trolling,"and perma-banned me. Italian Wikipedia and Simple English Wikipedia even have pages for Swalwell. Other hamlets in Alberta, even smaller than Swalwell's 338 people, have their own little pages.

Maybe the citizens of Swalwell will demand to have a Wikipedia page. There's apparently a nice bee-keeping business there.

Until then, Crum375 stands vigilant.

(Having categories and pages for every f*cking hamlet in Alberta epitomizes the Aspergerian ethos of Wikipedia, but that's a different topic. I just did this perfect new hamlet page as an exercise.)

Looks to me like a close meatpuppet relationship. No doubt they're in contact by e-mail, IM, maybe even telephone.

Not necessarily. SlimVirgin is somewhat predictable. He could simply be doing what he knows she would want him to do.

[everyking]

I had maybe 5 or 6 minor and very diverse, non-troll, non-vandal edits, over a period of some weeks, on my latest Wikipedia account. I just made SUCH a nice page for Swalwell, Alberta; intentionally as unobjectionable and bland and normal as possible; using all the proper templates and categories and Lat-Long coordinates. It was like the page for any other "hamlet" in Alberta (hamlets seem to be 500> people or so), a lot like the page for this hamlet, for example. Minimal, truthful, informative, using Canadian government data. It was OK for 24 hours, but then Crum375 deleted it as "trolling,"and perma-banned me. Italian Wikipedia and Simple English Wikipedia even have pages for Swalwell. Other hamlets in Alberta, even smaller than Swalwell's 338 people, have their own little pages.

Maybe the citizens of Swalwell will demand to have a Wikipedia page. There's apparently a nice bee-keeping business there.

Until then, Crum375 stands vigilant.

(Having categories and pages for every f*cking hamlet in Alberta epitomizes the Aspergerian ethos of Wikipedia, but that's a different topic. I just did this perfect new hamlet page as an exercise.)

Looks to me like a close meatpuppet relationship. No doubt they're in contact by e-mail, IM, maybe even telephone.

Not necessarily. SlimVirgin is somewhat predictable. He could simply be doing what he knows she would want him to do.

Presuming your article didn't mention SV in any way, that's completely ridiculous. I hope somebody will get behind the article and force it into an AfD, where it is almost certain to be kept.

[Somey]

Presuming your article didn't mention SV in any way, that's completely ridiculous. I hope somebody will get behind the article and force it into an AfD, where it is almost certain to be kept.

Ah, if only...

We can only hope, faintly and wistfully, that one day, the good, hard-working families of Swalwell can go to sleep at night secure in the knowledge that their proud efforts to make their community worthy of even a glimmer of the world's fleeting attention, and to commit their deeds and achievements to posterity, even in something as ephemeral as a popular publicly-editable website, will not have been in vain.

Alas, I fear it is not to be, and all that Swalwell and its people have ever been or ever will be, will ultimately be lost to history, swept away like so much dust in the wi - wait a minute, that was an old Kansas single, wasn't it? I must be totally losing it!

[yow]

Maybe I'll Babelfish-improve the Italian version -- and make it really good. The Italians don't like the English Wiki folks trying to have things deleted over there. They got really pissed at Jayjg once for trying to change something.

Presuming your article didn't mention SV in any way, that's completely ridiculous. I hope somebody will get behind the article and force it into an AfD, where it is almost certain to be kept.

Ah, if only...

We can only hope, faintly and wistfully, that one day, the good, hard-working families of Swalwell can go to sleep at night secure in the knowledge that their proud efforts to make their community worthy of even a glimmer of the world's fleeting attention, and to commit their deeds and achievements to posterity, even in something as ephemeral as a popular publicly-editable website, will not have been in vain.

Alas, I fear it is not to be, and all that Swalwell and its people have ever been or ever will be, will ultimately be lost to history, swept away like so much dust in the wi - wait a minute, that was an old Kansas single, wasn't it? I must be totally losing it!

[guy]

Have you tried putting the article on Wikinfo? Fred Bauder's very hospitable.

[Moulton]

...epitomizes the Aspergerian ethos of Wikipedia...

Simon Baron-Cohen characterizes the "Aspergian ethos" as a drive to "systematize" things.

Having a uniform and systematic approach would seem to be a desirable value for a encyclopedia.

But it occurs to me that Wikipedia does not exhibit a uniform and systematic approach to much of anything, except to playing out its own idiosyncratic dysfunctionality.

[yow]

Isn't that the guy who plays "Borat"? (just kidding)

I see what you mean. I think they tend to have this drive, but that they fail at it!

...epitomizes the Aspergerian ethos of Wikipedia...

Simon Baron-Cohen characterizes the "Aspergian ethos" as a drive to "systematize" things.

Having a uniform and systematic approach would seem to be a desirable value for a encyclopedia.

But it occurs to me that Wikipedia does not exhibit a uniform and systematic approach to much of anything, except to playing out its own idiosyncratic dysfunctionality.

[guy]

Isn't that the guy who plays "Borat"? (just kidding)

They're first cousins. I've never met Sacha but I know several members of the family.

[gomi]

There is a lovely slow-motion edit war underway on one of SlimVirgin's favourite pages, Attribution. Notice that, as Slim begins to eat away at her 3RR allocation, Crum375, who has not edited or appeared at this article in recent memory, swoops in the revert at just the right time

CODE

# 06:18, 13 November 2007 Crum375 (Talk | contribs) (18,783 bytes) (This is not historic, please discuss on talk if you disagree) (undo)
# 06:09, 13 November 2007 CJCurrie (Talk | contribs) (18,798 bytes) (I disagree; it reminds readers that there was never any consensus for this page. But perhaps this discussion would be better conducted on the talk page. (Should I assume you'll revert shortly?)) (undo)
#  05:56, 13 November 2007 SlimVirgin (Talk | contribs) (18,783 bytes) (pls stop this; it doesn't benefit anyone) (undo)
#  05:55, 13 November 2007 CJCurrie (Talk | contribs) (18,798 bytes) (I seem to remember that consensus for this page was unclear.) (undo)
#  00:33, 13 November 2007 SlimVirgin (Talk | contribs) m (18,783 bytes) (not historical because it's describing current policies) (undo)
#  00:32, 13 November 2007 CJCurrie (Talk | contribs) (18,798 bytes) (I don't believe the previous question was answered.) (undo)
...
# 10:56, 8 October 2007 Philip Baird Shearer (Talk | contribs) (18,798 bytes) (restored {{Historical}} As still no further discussion on the talk page about why it is not historical given we are waiting a report back) (undo)
# 22:19, 7 October 2007 CJCurrie (Talk | contribs) (18,783 bytes) (Restored previous tags -- I don't believe there's any agreement this is a "supplementary" page.) (undo)
...
# 14:08, 20 September 2007 Philip Baird Shearer (Talk | contribs) (16,738 bytes) (Put back accumulated changes, but removed Template:Historical as this is currently under discussion. SV if you do not like the changes, thn please try to reach a compromise on the tlk page with me) (undo)
# 11:11, 20 September 2007 SlimVirgin (Talk | contribs) m (18,783 bytes) (pls stop this) (undo)
# 09:41, 20 September 2007 Philip Baird Shearer (Talk | contribs) (16,752 bytes) (rv to last version by PBS. Please discuss on the talk page before reverting.) (undo)
# 00:35, 20 September 2007 SlimVirgin (Talk | contribs) (18,783 bytes) (back to Punctured Bicycle; it's not historical but an accurate summary of two policies that's still in use) (undo)
# 22:51, 19 September 2007 Philip Baird Shearer (Talk | contribs) (16,752 bytes) (Template:Historical as discussed on Wikipedia talk:Attribution#Status?) (undo)
...
# 11:12, 6 September 2007 Punctured Bicycle (Talk | contribs) m (18,783 bytes) (→Using questionable or self-published sources) (undo)
# 15:58, 28 August 2007 SlimVirgin (Talk | contribs) (18,785 bytes) (further back; this page is a summary of V and NOR, not RS) (undo)
# 15:56, 28 August 2007 SlimVirgin (Talk | contribs) (18,223 bytes) (back to August 13) (undo)
# 09:31, 16 August 2007 Philip Baird Shearer (Talk | contribs) (16,737 bytes) (Undid revision 151463253 by 172.159.84.236 (talk)) (undo)

[Aloft]

As far as backchannel communications are concerned, it doesn't get anymore obvious than that. Crum hasn't edited that page in a couple of months, and suddenly there he his, playing the part of Slim's lapdog meatpuppet yet again.

It's incredible the amount of drama, damage, and wasted manhours that SlimVirgin has caused with her Attribution policy.

[tarantino]

There is a lovely slow-motion edit war underway on one of SlimVirgin's favourite pages, Attribution. Notice that, as Slim begins to eat away at her 3RR allocation, Crum375, who has not edited or appeared at this article in recent memory, swoops in the revert at just the right time

The same thing is going on at Sock puppetry. SlimVirgin and Crum375 are reverting CJCurrie. CJCurrie reverts even after Viridae protects it, but Slim quickly rvs it back. There were several other participants that had joined in, including the obvious sock created on October 11, Relata refero. I'm not sure why s/he gets a pass on policy pages.

[KamrynMatika]

There is a lovely slow-motion edit war underway on one of SlimVirgin's favourite pages, Attribution. Notice that, as Slim begins to eat away at her 3RR allocation, Crum375, who has not edited or appeared at this article in recent memory, swoops in the revert at just the right time

The same thing is going on at Sock puppetry. SlimVirgin and Crum375 are reverting CJCurrie. CJCurrie reverts even after Viridae protects it, but Slim quickly rvs it back. There were several other participants that had joined in, including the obvious sock created on October 11, Relata refero. I'm not sure why s/he gets a pass on policy pages.

probably because she wrote most of them. not saying that excuses it, but people tend to defer to her simply because she's been around long enough to have had a hand in them. what they don't realise is that it's partly due to her influence that WP sucks as much as it does today.