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Ottava
post Thu 22nd March 2012, 8:13pm
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Just some things to show how stupid Wikipedians can be when it comes to sourcing.

"Martin left his father's girlfriend's home in the gated community of Twin Lakes to walk to a nearby 7-Eleven convenience store to buy some candy"

All reports I've seen have stated that the girlfriend did not live in the community but near it. So I looked at the source.

A clearly marked op-ed.

Then look at the article: "Trayvon had left the house he and his father were visiting to walk to the local 7-Eleven. "

The op-ed, not a reliable source, does not even contain the supposed "facts" that the article states. This is a really key point, because most news stories when covering both sides point out that the girlfriend of his dad did not live there, and that the boy was entering into the community without permission (it was gated and no clear way for him to get to the girlfriend's house).

So someone wanted to skew the truth, put forth a link to an op-ed that was inflammatory but did not lack the detail, and hoped no one noticed.


That is Wikipedia - not about verifiability or truth, but about how you can get your agenda across.
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Emperor
post Mon 26th March 2012, 1:06am
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QUOTE(Ottava @ Thu 22nd March 2012, 4:13pm) *

Just some things to show how stupid Wikipedians can be when it comes to sourcing.

"Martin left his father's girlfriend's home in the gated community of Twin Lakes to walk to a nearby 7-Eleven convenience store to buy some candy"

All reports I've seen have stated that the girlfriend did not live in the community but near it. So I looked at the source.

A clearly marked op-ed.

Then look at the article: "Trayvon had left the house he and his father were visiting to walk to the local 7-Eleven. "

The op-ed, not a reliable source, does not even contain the supposed "facts" that the article states. This is a really key point, because most news stories when covering both sides point out that the girlfriend of his dad did not live there, and that the boy was entering into the community without permission (it was gated and no clear way for him to get to the girlfriend's house).

So someone wanted to skew the truth, put forth a link to an op-ed that was inflammatory but did not lack the detail, and hoped no one noticed.


That is Wikipedia - not about verifiability or truth, but about how you can get your agenda across.


Encyclopedia articles about controversial current events. What could go wrong?




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Zoloft
post Mon 26th March 2012, 7:13am
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Wikipedia would do well to suppress the creation of articles that are essentially news.

Oh, sure, once they have time to get their act together, they provide a lot of information that is glossed over or screwed up by CNN or FOX or your local news-ripper newspaper, but the mistakes and POV-pushing and clueless scrambling for position during the first few days/weeks is embarrassing and misleads many people who search for information on Wikipedia.

Perhaps they should just have a team of volunteers build an article on an event as prominent as the Trayon Martin shooting—in non article space, then place it in Wikinews with a summary of that article in Wikipedia itself, and a prominent "Read More" link back to the main article at Wikinews.

One stone, multiple birds.
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milowent
post Mon 26th March 2012, 8:08pm
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while all manner of fights are erupting about trayvon, i'm not sure the fact of whether the girlfriend lived inside twin lakes or not is one of them, or even an important one. Tampa's paper just yesterday said she lived in the community. ("Trayvon Martin lived with his dad, who resides in the Miami area, and had visited his dad's girlfriend at the Retreat several times before.")

http://www.tampabay.com/news/humaninterest...akes-in/1221799

i wouldn't be shocked if the fact is wrong, though.

another fact that is completely wrong is the story that trayvon left the house during a break in the NBA All-Star game to go to the 7-11. He was dead before the game started, but that fact is repeatedly reported.

people are straining to make this a left v. right story, but its story of a dead kid who shouldn't be dead and a guy who wishes he didn't kill him. what else happened, who knows.
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Tarc
post Tue 27th March 2012, 12:12am
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QUOTE(Zoloft @ Mon 26th March 2012, 3:13am) *

Wikipedia would do well to suppress the creation of articles that are essentially news.


The existence of such articles is the raison d'être of the Article Rescue Squad. Plane crashes, train derailments, hiccuping girls, women walking into mall pools, judges who slap their daughters, reporters who have aneurisms on-air, and so on.

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Web Fred
post Tue 27th March 2012, 1:06am
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And no-one is reporting about what happened to the bag of candy?

HELL MAN, WHAT THE FUCK HAPPENED TO THE CANDY, SUGARHOLICS WISH TO KNOW!!!!!!?
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Ottava
post Tue 27th March 2012, 2:50am
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QUOTE(milowent @ Mon 26th March 2012, 4:08pm) *

while all manner of fights are erupting about trayvon, i'm not sure the fact of whether the girlfriend lived inside twin lakes or not is one of them, or even an important one. Tampa's paper just yesterday said she lived in the community. ("Trayvon Martin lived with his dad, who resides in the Miami area, and had visited his dad's girlfriend at the Retreat several times before.")



I saw that. There was another just yesterday doing the same thing. It is funny how no one reported that until well after Wikipedia originated that. It would not be the first time Wikipedia originated such "facts" because of poor research. Thus, the truth gets removed by people pushing a view.

It would be sad if the claim that the girlfriend lives there. Google Maps for 1111 Retreat View Circle to 1231 Twin Trees Ln, Sanford, FL (location according to Police Report). Typing in 7-11 Sanford, FL makes it unlikely that the boy lived in "Twin Lakes" as claimed, as the 7-11s are rather too far away to walk and across many highways or busy roads. The nearest being on 46, which is a mile away from the shooting site and across a major highway. More likely, he wandered away from home and started wandering alone to see what he could get up to (and, according to witnesses, was seeing attacking Zimmerman).

Many facts of the case are downplayed - such as his height and weight being greater than previous claimed (he is about my size, and capable of fighting), claims that he is too young to be violent (if you know high schools, age doesn't mean wont be violent), claims by his teacher that his suspension was about being late when it was really about drug use, etc. Even the fact that Zimmerman is Hispanic with many black family members is completely ignored by most of the media. It doesn't play into what they want to see, and Wikipedia does the same thing.




But anyway - the news can be horribly wrong - they were pulling in "facts" from a Trayvon that lived in California, such as the height (he is really over 6 foot tall according to the police report but the news claimed he was only 5'6" because they mistook the identity). Wikipedia just compounds it by spreading half truths or complete falsehoods. Wikipedia has become merely a propaganda tool.
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post Tue 27th March 2012, 11:32am
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QUOTE(Ottava @ Mon 26th March 2012, 10:50pm) *

Wikipedia just compounds it by spreading half truths or complete falsehoods. Wikipedia has become merely a propaganda tool.


The scary thing is, people are so fired up right now, talking about riots and other dumb stuff, that we could very well see multiple injuries and/or deaths resulting from Wikipedia spreading misinformation.

The other thing is I've read maybe a dozen stories and none of them have mentioned that things might have gone better if either of these people had gotten off their cell phones and engaged their brains. Also, in Florida, all pedestrians are looked at as freaks. It's a car-dominated culture.
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Zoloft
post Tue 27th March 2012, 11:43am
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QUOTE(Emperor @ Tue 27th March 2012, 4:32am) *

QUOTE(Ottava @ Mon 26th March 2012, 10:50pm) *

Wikipedia just compounds it by spreading half truths or complete falsehoods. Wikipedia has become merely a propaganda tool.


The scary thing is, people are so fired up right now, talking about riots and other dumb stuff, that we could very well see multiple injuries and/or deaths resulting from Wikipedia spreading misinformation.

...or from a black kid being shot and the police didn't arrest his shooter or even take his gun?
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post Tue 27th March 2012, 11:48am
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QUOTE(Zoloft @ Tue 27th March 2012, 7:43am) *

QUOTE(Emperor @ Tue 27th March 2012, 4:32am) *

QUOTE(Ottava @ Mon 26th March 2012, 10:50pm) *

Wikipedia just compounds it by spreading half truths or complete falsehoods. Wikipedia has become merely a propaganda tool.


The scary thing is, people are so fired up right now, talking about riots and other dumb stuff, that we could very well see multiple injuries and/or deaths resulting from Wikipedia spreading misinformation.

...or from a black kid being shot and the police didn't arrest his shooter or even take his gun?


Way to be part of the problem.
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post Tue 27th March 2012, 12:05pm
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QUOTE
And no-one is reporting about what happened to the bag of candy?


A pedophile took it and used the candy to lure little girls.
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Web Fred
post Tue 27th March 2012, 12:34pm
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QUOTE(Text @ Tue 27th March 2012, 1:05pm) *

QUOTE
And no-one is reporting about what happened to the bag of candy?


A pedophile took it and used the candy to lure little girls.


The bastard!

I could have given that poor candy a good home.
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Web Fred
post Tue 27th March 2012, 1:04pm
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QUOTE(Emperor @ Tue 27th March 2012, 12:48pm) *

QUOTE(Zoloft @ Tue 27th March 2012, 7:43am) *

QUOTE(Emperor @ Tue 27th March 2012, 4:32am) *

QUOTE(Ottava @ Mon 26th March 2012, 10:50pm) *

Wikipedia just compounds it by spreading half truths or complete falsehoods. Wikipedia has become merely a propaganda tool.


The scary thing is, people are so fired up right now, talking about riots and other dumb stuff, that we could very well see multiple injuries and/or deaths resulting from Wikipedia spreading misinformation.

...or from a black kid being shot and the police didn't arrest his shooter or even take his gun?


Way to be part of the problem.


Somehow I doubt it.

In any case Wikipedia is merely a corkboard where fuckwits post their points of view, until they get reverted to some bugger else's point of view.
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post Tue 27th March 2012, 1:52pm
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QUOTE(Web Fred @ Tue 27th March 2012, 9:04am) *

In any case Wikipedia is merely a corkboard where fuckwits post their points of view, until they get reverted to some bugger else's point of view.


Most people are not aware of that.
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Ottava
post Tue 27th March 2012, 4:11pm
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QUOTE(Zoloft @ Tue 27th March 2012, 7:43am) *

QUOTE(Emperor @ Tue 27th March 2012, 4:32am) *

QUOTE(Ottava @ Mon 26th March 2012, 10:50pm) *

Wikipedia just compounds it by spreading half truths or complete falsehoods. Wikipedia has become merely a propaganda tool.


The scary thing is, people are so fired up right now, talking about riots and other dumb stuff, that we could very well see multiple injuries and/or deaths resulting from Wikipedia spreading misinformation.

...or from a black kid being shot and the police didn't arrest his shooter or even take his gun?



Where did you hear that? The police put him in handcuffs and then took the gun and logged it in as evidence. They did not give the gun back. He was later released when there were 3 witnesses testifying he was on the ground being attacked and there was a broken nose and damage to the back of his head from being smashed into a sidewalk. That was strong evidence of needing self-defense.
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post Tue 27th March 2012, 7:14pm
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QUOTE
Most people are not aware of that.


Eventually they will become aware.

Eventually.
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A Horse With No Name
post Tue 27th March 2012, 7:48pm
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QUOTE(Web Fred @ Mon 26th March 2012, 9:06pm) *

And no-one is reporting about what happened to the bag of candy?

HELL MAN, WHAT THE FUCK HAPPENED TO THE CANDY, SUGARHOLICS WISH TO KNOW!!!!!!?


Well, if the picture of the tubby shooter is any indication, I suspect that he ate the evidence. ermm.gif

QUOTE(Ottava @ Tue 27th March 2012, 12:11pm) *
He was later released when there were 3 witnesses testifying he was on the ground being attacked and there was a broken nose and damage to the back of his head from being smashed into a sidewalk. That was strong evidence of needing self-defense.


But not hospitalization, which is usually what occurs after one's nose is broken and skull is smashed on a sidewalk. nope.gif


QUOTE(Emperor @ Tue 27th March 2012, 7:32am) *
Also, in Florida, all pedestrians are looked at as freaks. It's a car-dominated culture.


The U.S. would be better off if someone ran a giant chainsaw along the Florida border and allowed it to float off into the Atlantic. wacko.gif
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Web Fred
post Tue 27th March 2012, 7:54pm
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QUOTE(A Horse With No Name @ Tue 27th March 2012, 8:48pm) *

The U.S. would be better off if someone ran a giant chainsaw along the Florida border and allowed it to float off into the Atlantic. wacko.gif


Then where would New Yorkers go to kill people?
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Detective
post Tue 27th March 2012, 9:20pm
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QUOTE(A Horse With No Name @ Tue 27th March 2012, 8:48pm) *

The U.S. would be better off if someone ran a giant chainsaw along the Florida border and allowed it to float off into the Atlantic. wacko.gif

What would that do to U.S. presidential elections? It would take half the fun out of them.
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Malleus
post Tue 27th March 2012, 10:48pm
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QUOTE(Detective @ Tue 27th March 2012, 10:20pm) *

QUOTE(A Horse With No Name @ Tue 27th March 2012, 8:48pm) *

The U.S. would be better off if someone ran a giant chainsaw along the Florida border and allowed it to float off into the Atlantic. wacko.gif

What would that do to U.S. presidential elections? It would take half the fun out of them.

... and about an eighth of the corruption.
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