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> Proabivouac's question, (split from "hi")
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This is big enough for a thread to itself. It's split from "hi", into 2 posts.

QUOTE(Proabivouac @ Sun 31st August 2008, 7:50pm) *

FT2, per your earlier comments, there is much here to discuss. However, since you mentioned a lack of appreciable interaction between us, I believe I first heard of you when you showed up out of nowhere - presumably solicited from IRC - and, without warning, blocked me for a week for attempting to warn contributors that if they use their real name, they are likely to be attacked under that name on Wikipedia. Perhaps just another routine meatpuppet/adminpuppet block for you, but it made an impression on me. The second interaction between us was your and JzG's deletion of my very detailed and accurate sockpuppet reports (Oldwindybear, Orderinchaos, the first resigned, the second still an administrator) and subsequent indefinite block of my account - immediately overturned, but leaving a very false charge of "harassment" in my account history.


This seems to be a big one for you. For me, it was something I had no stake in, nor a big deal. It was a routine admin action as you say. You were not just "warning people" as your post suggests, though. if you want to look at the case though, for anyone else this is the link.

Uninvolved administrators routinely get asked to look at difficult or contested matters. I was asked in your case for two reasons - I have no prior "history" and had never heard of your name, and, it was a delicate situation and I tend to be very careful to review those for myself and not assume. My full post is linked above.

Reviewing your edit from almost a year later, I would probably say that it was trying to make a point disruptively, and also, that underneath there was something valid to it. In other words, it is worth saying, "we can't guarantee stuff wont happen thats bad". But you were making edits that together, were disruptive on that general theme, rather than collaborative, and you had a specific sanction because of past disruptive actions, to the effect of "don't do it any more". You know well that introducing a "well by this standard I think wikipedia is X" into a policy page is at best, [[WP:POINT]], and at worst plain disruptive and poor judgement. Whether or not it is factually so, the edit was uunhelpful and that is what I reviewed for. You may want to help newcomers, but not by making disruptive "POINTy" edits. My regrets on the block notice were genuine, if that means anything, but the assessment was neutral and would have been the same for anybody else who made edits of that kind when they knew better and under sanction. That's why you were blocked. I'm sorry it's taken nearly a year for you to feel able to ask more, but I'm glad you have, and if this doesn't satisfy then at least maybe it says "it wasn't malicious".

The page deletions are much easier. I was asked to look at those, and indeed we do have a policy on them. My post to you is here. You'll see this was a case where in July/August 2007 you prepared evidence pages for cases, but they weren't used as at April 2008. We have a standing norm that userspace pages like this are aimed for imminent use, you weren't editing or showing any signs of using them, and they were so old as to be doubtful if the events they showed would have been evidence for any current matter. Even so you'll see I didn't delete them. I blanked them - that is, added a "blank revision" which you could easily undo via history to get the version you edited, if you ever needed it. I also explained it on your talk page (slightly wrongly as you didn't need help to get your text back). Again, I'd have done the same for any very old "evidence page" I was asked about in anyone's userspace, including my own. It wasn't personal, and didn't delete it if ever needed again. But keeping it hanging there endlessly, for no reason, with no likely usage - not a good use of userspace.

Hope that helps clear it up a bit, if not completely reassures.
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FT2   Proabivouac's question  
Pumpkin Muffins   This is big enough for a thread to itself. It...  
FT2   (Snip) Um, duh? ... times a hundred ... you bl...  
Proabivouac   3/ I did not block him "indefinitely",...  
FT2   You think I'm stupid? You blanked my reports ...  
FT2   So, two more questions for now: 1) Given that you...  
Proabivouac   Uninvolved administrators routinely get asked to ...  
Kelly Martin   This is your typically roundabout way of saying yo...  
FT2   This is your typically roundabout way of saying y...  
Carruthers   [quote name='Kelly Martin' post='125286' date='Mo...  
FT2   My, you're starting off on the right foot her...  
Proabivouac   2/ The actual prompt was most likely [b][url=http...  
Carruthers   How on earth was this "disruptive", FT2...  
FT2   Blah blah blah… short form: you were meatpu...  
Dzonatas   And last, I'm being direct and straight with ...  
FT2   (Snip) Did you know my daughter was harassed on-...  
Carruthers   Arbitration is a last resort, and I cannot see a ...  
FT2   The voice that I personally fail to see on that A...  
Milton Roe   [quote name='Carruthers' post='125783' date='Tue ...  
FT2   It would be quite simple to allow users appealing...  
FT2   It would be quite simple to allow users appealing...  
Milton Roe   It would be quite simple to allow users appealin...  
FT2   Has it occured to you that many a newly blocked ed...  
Cla68   If I may interject here for a moment, FT2, could y...  
Carruthers   [quote name='Carruthers' post='125783' date='Tue ...  
FT2   [quote name='FT2' post='125790' date='Tue 2nd Sept...  
Dzonatas   Don't mean to derail this thread about my case...  
Peter Damian   I just want to respond to the statement FT2 made ...  
Jon Awbrey   [quote name='Dzonatas' post='126038' date='Wed 3r...  
Carruthers   [quote name='FT2' post='125790' date='Tue 2nd Sep...  
Moulton   I fail to see how you can justify a blind travesty...  
Random832   Come now, "if there was anything at IRC, whi...  
Proabivouac   "…it would most likely have been a hea...  
Kelly Martin   Your personal view beyond that is appreciated, and...  
thekohser   Your personal view beyond that is appreciated, an...  
Peter Damian   This refers: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_ta...  
FT2   This refers: [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U...  
Proabivouac   Please stop flooding the thread. I asked a questio...  
FT2   Please stop flooding the thread. I asked a questi...  
Proabivouac   Re-read this. Your belief isn't something I c...  
Peter Damian   [quote name='FT2' post='125337' date='Mon 1st Sep...  
Carruthers   This rather supports the idea of blocks orchestra...  
FT2   Quit beating around the bush. [b]Who told you you...  
Proabivouac   [quote name='Proabivouac' post='125338' date='Mon...  
Carruthers   FT2, as you are well aware, the key word is ...  
Peter Damian   * The unblocking admin himself, who also started...  
FT2   [quote name='FT2' post='125349' date='Mon 1st Sep...  
Peter Damian   [quote name='FT2' post='125349' date='Mon 1st Se...  
FT2   1. I had already checked those diffs, please don...  
Proabivouac   FT2, for the third time: If User:TBP wasn't y...  
Docknell   [quote name='FT2' post='125947' date='Wed 3rd Sep...  
Proabivouac   This rather supports the idea of blocks orchestr...  
Random832   Who asked you to do it, FT2? It's a straight ...  
Peter Damian   [quote name='Proabivouac' post='125574' date='Tue...  
Random832   Congratulations on missing my point entirely.  
Peter Damian   Congratulations on missing my point entirely. N...  
Peter Damian   My understanding is that you wanted to come her...  
Kelly Martin   A unanimous voice echoing out of a Star Chamber me...  
Kelly Martin   Why is FT2 lecturing us about Wikipedia? We all k...  
Milton Roe   Why is FT2 lecturing us about Wikipedia? We all ...  
FT2   Well, he's lecturing [i]me on stuff he's ...  
FT2   Why is FT2 lecturing us about Wikipedia? We all ...  
Docknell   Why is FT2 lecturing us about Wikipedia? We all...  
FT2   (Snip) Q: Is there perhaps any way you could act...  
Proabivouac   [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wi...  
Kelly Martin   From yourself - unlikely. Clearly proxied from you...  
FT2   [quote name='FT2' post='125931' date='Wed 3rd Sept...  
Kelly Martin   (With the exception of Docknell, that is, who - fo...  
Docknell   [quote name='Kelly Martin' post='1259...  
Docknell   Hi FT2, you said: Snip: Not really. Snip: I l...  
Jon Awbrey   From yourself — unlikely. Clearly proxie...  
Docknell   (Snip) Q: Is there perhaps any way you could ac...  
Carruthers   Why is FT2 lecturing us about Wikipedia? We all...  
Moulton   FT2, besides the long running RfAr that is nearing...  
Moulton   FT2, I suspect you missed seeing this last night b...  
Peter Damian   This is beginning to get surreal. FT2, do you have...  
Peter Damian   FT2 deserves an Oscar and a half at least! ...  
Kelly Martin   Or are they just fascinated by car crashes and tra...  
Taxwoman   Oscars are awarded for good acting. Not always. ...  
Peter Damian   Planning to stress myself over it or over others ...  
Milton Roe   I just noticed the link (an endorsement by a user...  
Moulton   Would it be possible to do an Umpiric Peer Review ...  
Docknell   Peer review on bestiality Would it be possible t...  
Cedric   Sadly, the only thing I can derive from this lengt...  
Jon Awbrey   http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/5f...  
Taxwoman   Sadly, the only thing I can derive from this leng...  
Milton Roe   [quote name='tarantino' post='124514' date='Fri 2...  


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