Jimbo puts arbcom in his will, they get the mojo Options

[SB_Johnny]

I guess this resolves the question of whether he'll ever voluntarily retire from the god-king job. Does this mean the foundation being in charge is just an imaginary thing?

[RDH(Ghost In The Machine)]

Don't like teh Jimness' stance on something?
Then wait 5 minutes.
His only constant is his inconstancy.

This post has been edited by RDH(Ghost In The Machine):

[thekohser]

...the ArbCom is hereby authorized to figure out what to do, subject to ratification with a 50% + 1 vote of the community.

I thought Wikipedia is NOT a democracy?

[Kelly Martin]

"A ratification vote of 50%+1 of the community"? That's an impossible condition because there's no defined sense of who is in the community or even what that term means. Every balloting in Wikipedia that has been held has been held under different terms, with no predictability whatsoever.

It's high irony for him to say that Wikipedia isn't suffering from "founder's syndrome" when it's fairly evident that Wikipedia is, in fact, a classic case of founder's syndrome. And it's fairly clear that the Foundation is not in charge of Wikipedia, nor does it want to be.

When Jimbo does leave (or die), the bloody infighting that will result is going to be quite amusing to watch.

[Ottava]

"A ratification vote of 50%+1 of the community"? That's an impossible condition because there's no defined sense of who is in the community or even what that term means. Every balloting in Wikipedia that has been held has been held under different terms, with no predictability whatsoever.

It's high irony for him to say that Wikipedia isn't suffering from "founder's syndrome" when it's fairly evident that Wikipedia is, in fact, a classic case of founder's syndrome. And it's fairly clear that the Foundation is not in charge of Wikipedia, nor does it want to be.

When Jimbo does leave (or die), the bloody infighting that will result is going to be quite amusing to watch.

Did everyone miss the idea that 50%+1 would need neutals to count as non-supports? Because he said vote and they did vote.

[Kelly Martin]

Did everyone miss the idea that 50%+1 would need neutals to count as non-supports? Because he said vote and they did vote.

In parliamentary procedure a "50%+1 vote of the membership" requires a majority of the membership (not merely a majority of those voting) to adopt the measure in question. The "membership" of the Association of Editors of the English Wikipedia is not well-defined. However, if we use the number of editors qualified to vote in the last ArbCom election it's somewhere between 10,000 and 100,000, which would mean somewhere between 5,000 and 50,000 votes in favor of ratification would be required. Since no ballot ever on the English Wikipedia has gathered more than a thousand or so votes, this bar is extremely unlikely to be reached.

Basically, Jimbo, in his clueless idiocy, has set a ratification bar that cannot possibly be reached.

"Neutral" votes have no meaning in parliamentary law other than to show presence for the purpose of determining quorum. The default decisional rule for a ballot is a majority of those present and expressing an opinion, and a "neutral" vote does not express an opinion. Since Wikipedia's elections have no concept of quorum, they're absolutely meaningless and should just be ignored. Robert's Rules explicitly comments that voting systems that treat abstensions as negative votes are generally undesirable and should be avoided (RONR 10th ed, p. 390).

[carbuncle]

I don't understand this at all. Surely whatever duties Jimbo has should be transferred to the WMF board. We've already seen instances where decisions made on English-language WP have been rejected by other projects (Commons rejecting the banning of Tyciol, for example, but I'm sure there are many other better examples). ArbCom doesn't have any standing except on English WP, right?

The second thing I don't understand is what Jimbo actually does outside of his role as a potent leader to inspire the masses. Why does he still have any duties at this point? He appoints ArbCom based on the results of an election. What else?

[Ottava]

I don't understand this at all. Surely whatever duties Jimbo has should be transferred to the WMF board. We've already seen instances where decisions made on English-language WP have been rejected by other projects (Commons rejecting the banning of Tyciol, for example, but I'm sure there are many other better examples). ArbCom doesn't have any standing except on English WP, right?

The second thing I don't understand is what Jimbo actually does outside of his role as a potent leader to inspire the masses. Why does he still have any duties at this point? He appoints ArbCom based on the results of an election. What else?

Cough.

I'm not completely incapable of getting things fixed when needed.


And was it worth giving the en-ArbCom an excuse to keep me banned just so that I could ensure that Tyciol was kept off Commons? Yes, yes it was.

This post has been edited by Ottava:

[SB_Johnny]

I don't understand this at all. Surely whatever duties Jimbo has should be transferred to the WMF board. We've already seen instances where decisions made on English-language WP have been rejected by other projects (Commons rejecting the banning of Tyciol, for example, but I'm sure there are many other better examples). ArbCom doesn't have any standing except on English WP, right?

The second thing I don't understand is what Jimbo actually does outside of his role as a potent leader to inspire the masses. Why does he still have any duties at this point? He appoints ArbCom based on the results of an election. What else?

I've been wondering about that myself... I thought that "technically speaking" he is simply appointed by the WMF board to oversee Arbcom, so why he would have that in his will doesn't make sense.

He also mentions:

I was planning to announce today a relinquishment of some of my traditional powers, as I have been doing over a long period of time, however writing that up in a precise manner is proving to be more difficult than I thought, despite my having thought quite a bit about what steps to take next. I will make a further announcement about that soon.

So apparently he must have some other powers too.

[carbuncle]

I don't understand this at all. Surely whatever duties Jimbo has should be transferred to the WMF board. We've already seen instances where decisions made on English-language WP have been rejected by other projects (Commons rejecting the banning of Tyciol, for example, but I'm sure there are many other better examples). ArbCom doesn't have any standing except on English WP, right?

The second thing I don't understand is what Jimbo actually does outside of his role as a potent leader to inspire the masses. Why does he still have any duties at this point? He appoints ArbCom based on the results of an election. What else?

Cough.

I'm not completely incapable of getting things fixed when needed.


And was it worth giving the en-ArbCom an excuse to keep me banned just so that I could ensure that Tyciol was kept off Commons? Yes, yes it was.

I didn't realize that it was you that got Tyciol banned.

[GlassBeadGame]

The direction from the grave of the disposition an entity which he does not have the power to determine even in life is the act of a vain and lost man. WMF's General Counsel should politely point his out to him.

[SB_Johnny]

"A ratification vote of 50%+1 of the community"? That's an impossible condition because there's no defined sense of who is in the community or even what that term means. Every balloting in Wikipedia that has been held has been held under different terms, with no predictability whatsoever.

I'm guessing he means "50% of whoever happens to vote", with who's actually allowed to vote presumably determined in his will or by some as yet unidentified cabal of worshippers.

It's high irony for him to say that Wikipedia isn't suffering from "founder's syndrome" when it's fairly evident that Wikipedia is, in fact, a classic case of founder's syndrome. And it's fairly clear that the Foundation is not in charge of Wikipedia, nor does it want to be.

When Jimbo does leave (or die), the bloody infighting that will result is going to be quite amusing to watch.

The lulz should be copious, yes. If it's not due to his abandoning of the mortal coil, my guess is that he will do the "retire/unretire/retire/unretire" thing so popular on WP and become the gift that keeps on giving.

[Kelly Martin]

I don't understand this at all. Surely whatever duties Jimbo has should be transferred to the WMF board.

The problem with that is that the Board doesn't want them, and will likely actively refuse to accept them.

Jimbo's authority with respect to the English Wikipedia is poorly-defined; Jimbo's take on it is that his powers are plenary and limited only by his own lack of will to use them. Even where he has explicitly declared a intent not to exercise some power or other, you will find that he considers those abdications revocable.

[RMHED]

The direction from the grave of the disposition an entity which he does not have the power to determine even in life is the act of a vain and lost man. WMF's General Counsel should politely point his out to him.

Not so much a "vain and lost man" as rather a muddle-headed one.

[Kelly Martin]

I've been wondering about that myself... I thought that "technically speaking" he is simply appointed by the WMF board to oversee Arbcom, so why he would have that in his will doesn't make sense.

Jimbo's authority over the English Wikipedia, in his opinion, is not mediated by or subject to the jurisdiction of the Board, since it predates the existence of the Wikimedia Foundation. The Board does not consider Jimmy to be exercising delegated authority when he acts as governor of the English Wikipedia.

[GlassBeadGame]

The direction from the grave of the disposition an entity which he does not have the power to determine even in life is the act of a vain and lost man. WMF's General Counsel should politely point his out to him.

Not so much a "vain and lost man" as rather a muddle-headed one.

Still WMF needs to short this out. A best as I can sort out Mr. Wales asserts that he has some "special rights" retained even as against WMF based on his control of buttons in the RPG of Wikipedia. This is an unsupportable and intolerable position for the corporation which at the end of the day needs to assert its authority over whatever occurs on its own servers. Imagine a WoW player that gained privileges that permitted him to ruin the experience for other players. Here, given the supposedly charitable purpose of the corporation, such a situation is even less tolerable.

[Kelly Martin]

Why does he still have any duties at this point? He appoints ArbCom based on the results of an election. What else?

Jimbo has no duties, only powers.

[RMHED]

Why does he still have any duties at this point? He appoints ArbCom based on the results of an election. What else?

Jimbo has no duties, only powers.

Jimmy ultimately aspires to be the éminence grise of Wikipedia; Power without any real responsibility.

This post has been edited by RMHED:

[TungstenCarbide]

Why does he still have any duties at this point? He appoints ArbCom based on the results of an election. What else?

Jimbo has no duties, only powers.

(IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/laugh.gif)
For how many of you has Jimbo promised to "look into it".

[SB_Johnny]

Why does he still have any duties at this point? He appoints ArbCom based on the results of an election. What else?

Jimbo has no duties, only powers.

(IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/laugh.gif)
For how many of you has Jimbo promised to "look into it".

(IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/laugh.gif) (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/laugh.gif) (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/laugh.gif) (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/laugh.gif)