FORUM WARNING [2] Division by zero (Line: 2933 of /srcsgcaop/boardclass.php) FORUM WARNING [2] Division by zero (Line: 2943 of /srcsgcaop/boardclass.php) Herostratus - love me or leave me -
Regarding "On [failing to adhere to the standard of decorum expected of administrators] I've served my sentence, in that I was taken to the woodshed by ArbCom, so why should I be punished again now?", in my opinion the fact that you're apparently treating this whole process as one big joke shows that the lesson clearly hasn't sunk in. Wikipedia now isn't the Wikipedia of five years ago, made up of a relatively close-knit community who mostly knew each other and shared each other's in-jokes; it's a loose-knit global community of around 40,000 occasional editors and 4,000 regulars, and what was appropriate then isn't appropriate now; not in an editor and certainly not in an admin. Like it or not, WP:NOBIGDEAL is a thing of the past and those 8,000 new editors joining each month do look to admins as role models; crap like this is never going to be appropriate any more. Resign, and come back in six months if you find you actually miss adminship; I'll lay a reasonable bet that you'll find you don't. – iridescent 16:52, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
You're being too reasonable, dear. Hero's been a smarmy twat ever since he first logged in. And that recall page ought to be an embarrassment to Wikipedia, yet hardly anyone even looks at it.
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QUOTE(EricBarbour @ Wed 23rd June 2010, 9:44pm)
You're being too reasonable, dear. Hero's been a smarmy twat ever since he first logged in. And that recall page ought to be an embarrassment to Wikipedia, yet hardly anyone even looks at it.
Re-read what I wrote, it was worded quite carefully. Wikipedia five years ago was a bunch of nerds and weirdos sharing crappy in-jokes and maintaining a shitty website that nobody read, and people like this fit right in. Wikipedia now (whether you think it's a good or a bad thing) is full of kids and casual visitors who aren't steeped in net-nerd culture, maintaining a still-shitty website that lots of people read. The kind of fuckwittery that was acceptable five years ago, since nobody gave a shit, is no longer appropriate. The vast majority of Wikipedia's "problem" admins are members of this pre-2006 old guard, fighting to maintain their status in a culture where they're increasingly out of place.
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QUOTE(Eva Destruction @ Wed 23rd June 2010, 1:50pm)
The kind of fuckwittery that was acceptable five years ago, since nobody gave a shit, is no longer appropriate. The vast majority of Wikipedia's "problem" admins are members of this pre-2006 old guard, fighting to maintain their status in a culture where they're increasingly out of place.
Absolutely well-said.
(Did you read this? Does that not scream "smarmy twit" or what?)
Perhaps I should tiptoe around Herostratus, he being damaged goods.
My ultimate point: he's not the only one getting away with it. Clearly, Wikipedia has an ingrained culture of smarminess and assholery. By all means, recall Herostratus, if you can. His recall has attracted some of the worst of WP's admin freak-show, people like Cirt and Stifle. If sanity prevailed, THEY should be recalled, too. And so should a long list of other smarmy twits, who have had the Magic Admin Fairy Wand too damned long.
Here's a WP: BOLD idea for ya. If WP was run by reasonable people, adminship would be a short-term position, perhaps for two years or thereabouts. Even American Congressmen, despite a general systemic tendency to be reelected automatically, still have to re-run for the seat every two years.
But nooooo.......adminship is a lifetime appointment. So, nerds and crackpots vote each other into the club for life. Great idea! Guarantees quality! [/sarcasm]
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QUOTE(EricBarbour @ Wed 23rd June 2010, 2:04pm)
But nooooo.......adminship is a lifetime appointment. So, nerds and crackpots vote each other into the club for life. Great idea! Guarantees quality! [/sarcasm]
And Caesar was granted the title "Dictator for Life..."
It might even change the culture a bit if they called these positions what they are, which is Administrator for Life.
At present, I think it's only partly power-hunger that keeps the present beaurocracy in place. Yes, of course Stifle and his ilk knows he'd never survive "re-election." The other part of it, though, is shear laziness. The site creaks along on a couple of thousand admins who mostly spend their time doing work a machine could do for them (although the new weak version of flagged revisions, I predict will spread and become the norm, eventually). They're short-handed as it is, and don't quite know what to do about it. If everything turned over every two years, it would just add that much work to the thing.
And frighteningly it's 11/8/6. Thus the early signs are that plenty of people might want herostratus to be an admin. (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/blink.gif) Of course, a lot can happen in seven days ...
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QUOTE
Support: If for no other reason than to offset Cirt's stupidity below. --MZMcBride (talk) 16:35, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
For those of you who don't read Hollywood Reporter, McBride was recently cast as Prof. Phineas J. Whoopie in the upcoming live-action feature film based on "Tennessee Tuxedo." (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/blink.gif)
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QUOTE(A Horse With No Name @ Wed 23rd June 2010, 7:12pm)
QUOTE
Support: If for no other reason than to offset Cirt's stupidity below. --MZMcBride (talk) 16:35, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
For those of you who don't read Hollywood Reporter, McBride was recently cast as Prof. Phineas J. Whoopie in the upcoming live-action feature film based on "Tennessee Tuxedo." (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/blink.gif)
Jesus, if you're going to insult someone, at least include a YouTube or Wikipedia link. Like I have any idea what the hell "Tennessee Tuxedo" is (and I'm certainly not alone). Perhaps best to stick to a non-comedic profession.
Is there anything lamer than a neutral vote at RFA? What is the point of these?
To me, they read "I haven't seen which way the wind is blowing, so I can't vote yet in case I'm on the losing side". (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/confused.gif)
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QUOTE(MZMcBride @ Wed 23rd June 2010, 8:34pm)
QUOTE(A Horse With No Name @ Wed 23rd June 2010, 7:12pm)
QUOTE
Support: If for no other reason than to offset Cirt's stupidity below. --MZMcBride (talk) 16:35, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
For those of you who don't read Hollywood Reporter, McBride was recently cast as Prof. Phineas J. Whoopie in the upcoming live-action feature film based on "Tennessee Tuxedo." (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/blink.gif)
Jesus, if you're going to insult someone, at least include a YouTube or Wikipedia link. Like I have any idea what the hell "Tennessee Tuxedo" is (and I'm certainly not alone). Perhaps best to stick to a non-comedic profession.
Stuff and nonsense! Next you will try to convince us you have never heard of the famous Commander McBragg. Balderdash, Chumley! Unalloyed buncombe!
i opposed the recall because the guy has a freakin sense of humor and the new RFA was a witch-hunt because Herostratus called a ridiculously marginal BLP subject a "mook" and "homophobe" in an AfD. Big whoop.
i opposed the recall because the guy has a freakin sense of humor and the new RFA was a witch-hunt because Herostratus called a ridiculously marginal BLP subject a "mook" and "homophobe" in an AfD. Big whoop.
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QUOTE(milowent @ Thu 24th June 2010, 5:31am)
i opposed the recall because the guy has a freakin sense of humor and the new RFA was a witch-hunt because Herostratus called a ridiculously marginal BLP subject a "mook" and "homophobe" in an AfD. Big whoop.
Perhaps you have a less self-aware sense of humor than I do, because I find his "jokes" to be amazingly imbecilic, pedantic and tactless. Just being self-effacing isn't quite sufficient. (Especially if you're gonna make light of your intensive editing of articles dealing with pedophilia.) Perhaps it's a wiki-witch-hunt, it isn't the first and it damn well won't be the last. Still, I'm having difficulty managing some sympathy.
After reopening, now it's 14/20/12. Not going too well, eh, Hero, you dick?......
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QUOTE(EricBarbour @ Thu 24th June 2010, 9:34am)
Perhaps you have a less self-aware sense of humor than I do, because I find his "jokes" to be amazingly imbecilic, pedantic and tactless.
Exactly. Either you think Wikipedia's a failure as an "encyclopedia" and has become a chatroom full of kids, in which case this kind of thing is totally inappropriate. Or, you think Wikipedia still has the potential to be a genuine academic project, in which case this kind of thing is totally inappropriate. I find it hard to imagine anywhere where this kind of sub-Horsey "comedy" would be appropriate—I doubt even ED would want it.
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QUOTE(MZMcBride @ Wed 23rd June 2010, 9:34pm)
Jesus, if you're going to insult someone, at least include a YouTube or Wikipedia link. Like I have any idea what the hell "Tennessee Tuxedo" is (and I'm certainly not alone). Perhaps best to stick to a non-comedic profession.
First, my name is not Jesus. Second, I never write for the lowest common denominator. And, third, anyone who has never heard of Tennessee Tuxedo is a ninny. (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/dry.gif)
QUOTE(Eva Destruction @ Thu 24th June 2010, 5:58am)
Besides, I would never (1) make fun of the Dutch -- Queen Beatrix is still hot, (2) make fun of drug addicts -- too many of my friends had ruined lives because of that, (3) make fun of the constellation Orion -- it happens to be my favorite constellation, (4) make fun of Mendel -- simply because there is no reason to, and (5) write something as thoroughly dismal as that paragraph. So stick that in your pipe and smoke it. (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/yecch.gif)
Unrelated observation: Nice to see "noobs" like Andromedabluesphere440, East of Borschov, The Blade of the Northern Lights and Tommy2010 becoming well-versed regulars at RfA after a mere three or four months on Wikipedia. (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/wink.gif)
This post has been edited by A Horse With No Name:
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I wonder if Nihonjoe realizes that what he did is an abuse of Bureaucratic ops and that he can now have them removed by ArbCom or the community through a similar request. That would be interesting, as I don't really remember much from Nihonjoe that has ever made me think that he would be trustworthy with adminship let alone something else.
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QUOTE(Ottava @ Thu 24th June 2010, 9:13am)
I wonder if Nihonjoe realizes that what he did is an abuse of Bureaucratic ops and that he can now have them removed by ArbCom or the community through a similar request.
I doubt it, personally. Word on the street is that he's suffering from advanced Alzheimer's Disease and doesn't even know his own address, or the names of any of his 573 children, all by different women. Moreover, he's been forced to live under a park bench, nearly starving to death, because he can't remember the PIN for his ATM card in order to get access to his checking account - which is rumored to contain over $47 million due to his having one the Mega Millions Lottery just over a year ago. As a result, his internet access has been spotty, since he's been having to lug his EeePC netbook into various coffee shops and shopping mall food courts in order to connect. Luckily, none of this has interfered with his administrator/bureaucrat duties on Wikipedia - if anything, these factors have actually enhanced his ability to implement administrative actions that are consistent with Wikipedia policy and procedure, as evidenced by his apparent support of User:Herostratus.
Despite his having been treated somewhat unfairly (IMO) here and elsewhere for his attempts to take a supposedly "constructive" approach to the WP pedophile problem, I still believe Herostratus should not be an admin, even on a site like Wikipedia.
QUOTE
That would be interesting, as I don't really remember much from Nihonjoe that has ever made me think that he would be trustworthy with adminship let alone something else.
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QUOTE(Ottava @ Thu 24th June 2010, 3:13pm)
I wonder if Nihonjoe realizes that what he did is an abuse of Bureaucratic ops and that he can now have them removed by ArbCom or the community through a similar request. That would be interesting, as I don't really remember much from Nihonjoe that has ever made me think that he would be trustworthy with adminship let alone something else.
Nihonjoe is no fool; he knew exactly what he was doing. It seems to me a perfect example of when you should use WP:IAR. It was a breach of the rules with the aim of improving the project. We should be pleased that there is a bureaucrat with the intelligence and bravery to use WP:IAR so effectively.
I wonder if Nihonjoe realizes that what he did is an abuse of Bureaucratic ops and that he can now have them removed by ArbCom or the community through a similar request. That would be interesting, as I don't really remember much from Nihonjoe that has ever made me think that he would be trustworthy with adminship let alone something else.
Nihonjoe is no fool; he knew exactly what he was doing. It seems to me a perfect example of when you should use WP:IAR. It was a breach of the rules with the aim of improving the project. We should be pleased that there is a bureaucrat with the intelligence and bravery to use WP:IAR so effectively.
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QUOTE(ulsterman @ Fri 25th June 2010, 6:36am)
QUOTE(Ottava @ Thu 24th June 2010, 3:13pm)
I wonder if Nihonjoe realizes that what he did is an abuse of Bureaucratic ops and that he can now have them removed by ArbCom or the community through a similar request. That would be interesting, as I don't really remember much from Nihonjoe that has ever made me think that he would be trustworthy with adminship let alone something else.
Nihonjoe is no fool; he knew exactly what he was doing. It seems to me a perfect example of when you should use WP:IAR. It was a breach of the rules with the aim of improving the project. We should be pleased that there is a bureaucrat with the intelligence and bravery to use WP:IAR so effectively.
You really have fallen for the whole Wikipedia thing haven't you? I think there is a 12 step program that could make you normal again.
What do you say we set up a poll here...how many people think Nihonjoe is a fool and how many people think he isn't? That should be interesting. (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/evilgrin.gif)
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QUOTE(ulsterman @ Thu 24th June 2010, 4:36pm)
QUOTE(Ottava @ Thu 24th June 2010, 3:13pm)
I wonder if Nihonjoe realizes that what he did is an abuse of Bureaucratic ops and that he can now have them removed by ArbCom or the community through a similar request. That would be interesting, as I don't really remember much from Nihonjoe that has ever made me think that he would be trustworthy with adminship let alone something else.
Nihonjoe is no fool; he knew exactly what he was doing. It seems to me a perfect example of when you should use WP:IAR. It was a breach of the rules with the aim of improving the project. We should be pleased that there is a bureaucrat with the intelligence and bravery to use WP:IAR so effectively.
From WP:RFA: "Any user may nominate another user with an account."
It does not say "another user without administrator status already".
RfA can be held for those who have adminship already. Everyone who has ever opened up that page can clearly read that. Nihonjoe is a liar and obviously blind.
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Jimbo has proclaimed his latest "philosophical thoughts". I'm reminded of Jack Handy.* His first axiom is that "[t]here is broad support for the idea that admins need not keep the same high level of popularity that was necessary to originally become an admin." It's a little like putting the cart before the horse, then shooting the horse while the cart rolls back over the carcass, and then pondering where to go from there. He finishes with this moving endorsement:
QUOTE
It is not clear to me that we can write a policy that gains broad consensus. But if we can, I support the idea in principle.
Now THAT is leadership.
*I think it's sad that a family can be torn apart by something as simple as a pack of wild dogs.
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QUOTE(Subtle Bee @ Thu 24th June 2010, 6:33pm)
It's a little like putting the cart before the horse, then shooting the horse while the cart rolls back over the carcass, and then pondering where to go from there.
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QUOTE(A Horse With No Name @ Thu 24th June 2010, 6:20pm)
QUOTE(Subtle Bee @ Thu 24th June 2010, 6:33pm)
It's a little like putting the cart before the horse, then shooting the horse while the cart rolls back over the carcass, and then pondering where to go from there.
1. It makes a poor metaphor - what do you put in front of a tapir? Its snout? More tapirs? 2. Tapirs already have it pretty hard. 3. Inasmuch as you're a horse, I'm a bee. Sometimes I sting.
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QUOTE(Subtle Bee @ Thu 24th June 2010, 6:34pm)
QUOTE(A Horse With No Name @ Thu 24th June 2010, 6:20pm)
QUOTE(Subtle Bee @ Thu 24th June 2010, 6:33pm)
It's a little like putting the cart before the horse, then shooting the horse while the cart rolls back over the carcass, and then pondering where to go from there.
1. It makes a poor metaphor - what do you put in front of a tapir? Its snout? More tapirs? 2. Tapirs already have it pretty hard. 3. Inasmuch as you're a horse, I'm a bee. Sometimes I sting.
It's beyond my control.
Hey, tapirs sometimes make great metaphors. Even for abuse. What you put in front of them is (obviously) an alien-controlled hominid with a bone to pick.
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current vote tally: 40/29/12
it was even at the beginning, took a big swing for the negative, and has slowly swung in his favor, though there are still 5 days to go if it stays open for the whole 7 days.
1. It makes a poor metaphor - what do you put in front of a tapir? Its snout? More tapirs? 2. Tapirs already have it pretty hard. 3. Inasmuch as you're a horse, I'm a bee. Sometimes I sting.
It's beyond my control.
Hey, tapirs sometimes make great metaphors. Even for abuse. What you put in front of them is (obviously) an alien-controlled hominid with a bone to pick.
Yeah well, use it in a sentence (ok, another one). I swear, it's like pearls before swine (see what I did there?). Anyway, that still leaves 2, 3, and Malkovich.
Besides, tapirs are essentially short, fat, big-nosed horses, so naturally our elitist equine would encourage me to pick on them. But I'll be damned if I'll succumb to the sort of creeping ottavism that expects to dictate my editorial decisions.
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QUOTE(CharlotteWebb @ Thu 24th June 2010, 7:54pm)
This thread has begun to tapir into stupidity.
But it cannot die, until Herostratus' fate is decided. And hair and fingernails grow for 48 hours after death, but phone calls tapir off.* (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/tongue.gif)
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QUOTE(Milton Roe @ Fri 25th June 2010, 3:10am)
But it cannot die, until Herostratus' fate is decided. And hair and fingernails grow for 48 hours after death, but phone calls tapir off.* (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/tongue.gif)
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QUOTE(Milton Roe @ Thu 24th June 2010, 8:10pm)
QUOTE(CharlotteWebb @ Thu 24th June 2010, 7:54pm)
This thread has begun to tapir into stupidity.
But it cannot die, until Herostratus' fate is decided. And hair and fingernails grow for 48 hours after death, but phone calls tapir off.* (IMG:smilys0b23ax56/default/tongue.gif)
Whatever, I offered a dash of actual content, I don't get to pick what we talk about (see creeping ottavism). But quite by accident, I found this gem that perfectly encapsulates the essence of this thread, so while we're all waiting for shoes to drop we can enjoy it together!
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Herostratus - love me or leave me
