JzG pushing for ban of a POV again, He's at AN stirring up the mob Options

[Abd]

I wonder how often Britannica has discussions like this

Wouldn't that be fun to know?

There must be some arguments on Britannica between contributors, or between editors and contributors. No doubt more civilised and better-informed than most of what passes for debate and seeking consensus, but they exist. Whatever defects Wikipedia has, article discussions are generaly in the open for the world to see. (Or are there loads on e-mails I don't know about?)

Sometimes Talk discussions are useful. If there has been serious contention, though, they can be ridiculous to follow. What's needed is a consensus report on why the article is the way it is. Carcharoth called this an article FAQ in the RfAr that banned me. Guess what editor would have worked on that?

[Abd]

Somebody finally waved a red flag in front of JzG's nose. He rushed right off and filed the most idiotic AN/I report. I've ever seen from someone with his level of experience.

But I think I've figured out his method. He just tosses as much mud as he can think of. It doesn't matter -- at all -- if there is any truth to it, it simply needs to seem like a description of a disruptive editor.

Unless editors actually follow the links and check them out carefully -- sometimes a superficial examination will confirm what he's saying, whereas a deeper one would uncover that the mine has been salted, and innocent stuff has been framed to make it look awful -- an accumulation builds, so that when he finally shows up with a ban proposal (he's not likely to personally block any more, when he's on this kind of mission), editors pile in with "Yeah, that editor has been nothing but trouble."

Because they have seen so many reports. Combine this with a faction, and it's brutal, because those reports can be, and will be, spread out a bit. And people will readily and understandably assume that someone who is getting many editors pissed off must be disruptive. Even if the actual disruption is coming from a handful of editors who focus narrowly on an area, with part of their time.

He was completely wrong about User:Abd/Sandbox. But if there is anywhere I should be able to express myself freely, it would be that page!

What would be needed to counter this tactic would be one or more editors to contradict his claims, and not just his "target." I used to do this, but I'm banned from it. (Why? Good question!) Then, whenever he files false or misleading charges, the impression falls on him, where it belongs. And, eventually, something can and will be done about it.

But if, as usually happens, that stuff just stands, even if it simply goes away into the archive, he has accomplished his goal: smearing the editor, preparing for the lynching.

[A Horse With No Name]

...he has accomplished his goal: smearing the editor, preparing for the lynching.

The lynching? You may be strange and you may be fruity, but you ain't strange fruit.



This post has been edited by A Horse With No Name: Wed 22nd September 2010, 7:21pm

[Abd]

...he has accomplished his goal: smearing the editor, preparing for the lynching.

The lynching? You may be strange and you may be fruity, but you ain't strange fruit.

It's a metaphor, Horse, referring to a mob action. I could show many examples where JzG fired up the mob with this kind of behavior. It included ArbComm, in RfAr/Cold fusion, where a substantially innocent article Pcarbonn wrote, published outside, was fanned into an impression of a "battleground mentality." I should probably write an essay on that. When Pcarbonn came back from his year ban, he was promptly assassinated -- can you handle the metaphor, Horse? -- at AN by JzG, using his classic techniques of misrepresentation.

JzG presented this as a matter of Pcarbonn pushing "the same POV as he was banned for." Wait a minute! In the case itself, there wasn't any banning of Pcarbonn for his "POV," but for "battlefield mentality." So what was Pcarbonn doing when he came back? Making piles of POV edits to the article?

No. He was writing in Talk, pointing to the sources that he knows well, since he became COI. Nothing disruptive. The sources can be seen as supporting a pro-cold fusion POV, which is where peer-reviewed RS has been going since 2005, easily.

What JzG did at AN, if anyone was watching, was promote his own anti-cold fusion POV, by arranging the ban of anyone with the knowledge and editorial skills to oppose it.

He didn't do that with me, rather, it was clear that his friends did it for him, you can look at RfC/JzG 3, where I pointed out his abusive actions as an admin, which ArbComm confirmed. Before the RfAr, in that RfC, you can see the cabal assemble to call for me to be banned. For pointing out abuse by their friend, fully and concisely documented. No, not walls of text!

So then one of their friends set it up, Hipocrite. And WMC did the first deed, declaring a ban, with an action that the community later rejected. The cabal spent his admin bit on this affair, that's how threatening they thought I was.

Was this a conscious conspiracy? Probably not. It's just the way it works.

When the cabal piled in to RfAr/Abd-William M. Connolley, ArbComm was overwhelmed by the traffic. Hey, if that many editors are upset by this guy, he must be disruptive. And he writes too much, I don't understand it. Off with his head!

(ArbComm rode roughshod over their own drafting arb.... Ah, well, that's ArbComm, eh?)

This post has been edited by Abd: Wed 22nd September 2010, 7:35pm

[thekohser]

... filed the most idiotic AN/I report.. I've ever seen...

You must be new to reading the AN/I page, Abd. That one doesn't even come close.

This post has been edited by thekohser: Wed 22nd September 2010, 7:48pm

[A Horse With No Name]

...can you handle the metaphor, Horse?

I've got the right-sized handle for any metaphor.

[Milton Roe]

...he has accomplished his goal: smearing the editor, preparing for the lynching.

The lynching? You may be strange and you may be fruity, but you ain't strange fruit.

A lynched horse would be strange fruit, indeed!

Nina Simone's cover of this song is even grittier. I have it on my iPod.

[Abd]

... filed the most idiotic AN/I report.. I've ever seen...

You must be new to reading the AN/I page, Abd. That one doesn't even come close.

Not new, but I have trouble remembering total nonsense. This particular post of JzG's, actually, isn't total nonsense except in actual content. It serves his purpose, to smear. If text serves its purpose, it isn't total nonsense.

I must admit, though, that I've not seen an AN/I report based on a user's Sandbox, though I could imagine that one could, in fact, use a Sandbox abusively. But as charged? No.

What the extremity of it did was to demonstrate his purpose, if anyone is watching. Usually nobody is, people just see a report like that in passing. Which is exactly what he wants.

[A Horse With No Name]

Is Guy Chapman as boring in real life as he is on Wikipedia?

[Abd]

Is Guy Chapman as boring in real life as he is on Wikipedia?

Let's say I'm not eager to find out.

He just dropped a nice little revelation of the source of his POV on Cold fusion on User talk:NewYorkBrad. His friend told him that the Featured Article on Cold fusion wasn't bad. That was probably about 2006 or so, maybe earlier.

I pointed him to the review of the field published in Naturwissenschaften, Status of cold fusion (2010). The reality, to the peer reviewers, is a little different than Guy's memory of what his friend told him years ago.

I helped write that review, and Storms was kind enough to mention me.

I am so glad that I was banned on Wikipedia. Think how much time I could have wasted there! Now that I'm off the ban, indeed, I'm slogging through the shit again. It's possible to get somewhere, but I don't recommend the trip.

It was not refreshing to be reminded of how obtuse and downright vicious some of these people can be.

[Abd]

And JzG has volunteered to be a speaker about the WMF!

United Kingdom: hey, if Kohs can do it then so can I. At least I actually subscribe to the foundation goals.

Wow, should I make sure he lets me know if he actually speaks somewhere, so I can tell all my friend in the U.K. that is is a must-attend?

JzG has, indeed, been a tireless volunteer at times, but he's also wrecked a lot. Telling editors to "Fuck off!" was an expression of "subscribing to the foundation goals"? Did he ever apologize for any of this? He's lied and distorted and sought to ban anyone who disagreed with him, thus essentially attacking the fundamental neutrality policy and the basis for consensus.

Yeah, I'd like to hear him defend "neutrality" and "consensus" given how much energy he put into attacking them. Based, in the case of cold fusion, on the opinion of his "friend," the hell with policy, reliable sources, recusal, and all that crap.

[thekohser]

And JzG has volunteered to be a speaker about the WMF!

United Kingdom: hey, if Kohs can do it then so can I. At least I actually subscribe to the foundation goals.

That wouldn't be the first time Guy Chapman couldn't be creative on his own and had to copy me.

[Abd]

And here he goes again! His favorite expression about me used to be that I was "beating a dead horse." I don't do that. Horse, I'd never do that, I wouldn't even beat a live horse. Might offer one a carrot. Might kiss a filly. I like the fillies, I do.... especially humans.

But JzG would beat one. Here he goes with a dead one, but he has sometimes been able to convince the Wikipediots that, why, he's got a point there!

Yeah, Fringe! Yeah, Proxying! Yeah, Walls-o-Text ™! Yeah, Obviously He Hasn't Learned His Lesson! Where's the rope?

I'm sitting here wondering if I can get to play Whack-a-Mole, too! I've played the "legitimate user" side a few times, with some pretty nasty socks, but never the really fun mole side. My own rules say that I can't do that unless I'm blocked, more than, say, a week or two, illegitimately. That cancels the social contract.

Wikipedia has never seen what I'd do if not restrained. But ... I don't really know myself. It's pretty boring, that place. Kinda removed from Real Life, don't y'all think?

for later generations bored enough to read this, a permanent link.

This post has been edited by Abd: Tue 5th October 2010, 12:35am

[dtobias]

I like the fillies, I do....

What about the Phillies?

[A Horse With No Name]

And here he goes again! His favorite expression about me used to be that I was "beating a dead horse." I don't do that. Horse, I'd never do that, I wouldn't even beat a live horse. Might offer one a carrot. Might kiss a filly. I like the fillies, I do.... especially humans.

Fear not, Abd...I have faith in you.

As for Guy Chapman...eh, tell him to go use a carrot as a suppository.

[Milton Roe]

I like the fillies, I do....

What about the Phillies?

What about phillately? They say that womanizing, like science, is either physics or stampcollecting.

What about flatleys? Have you seen Lord of the Dunce?

[Abd]

And here he goes again! His favorite expression about me used to be that I was "beating a dead horse." I don't do that. Horse, I'd never do that, I wouldn't even beat a live horse. Might offer one a carrot. Might kiss a filly. I like the fillies, I do.... especially humans.

Fear not, Abd...I have faith in you.

As for Guy Chapman...eh, tell him to go use a carrot as a suppository.

Very tempting. On what page do you suggest, and should I be logged in?

Hey, folks, IP editors, you can tell him and they will think it was me and they will waste piles of time with checkuser and all that, or they will point to Wikipedia Review as proof that I'm a disruptive troll and ... I really DGAF.

I behave on-wiki. If they kick me off, all bets are off, the contract has been cancelled. Might be more fun. Off-wiki, it's my own life, my own dime, my own time. It's the same on-wiki, but .... there is that social contract, tattered and torn as it is, with those dark stains on it from all the shit. It's getting hard to read.

[Abd]

I like the fillies, I do....

What about the Phillies?

Well, I've never been much of a baseball fan, but my 9-year old daughter has taken to the Red Sox, so ... I've noticed myself starting to listen to the radio. It would be the Red Sox, of course, not the Phillies. My daughter would be horrified by anything else.

Now, about that Guy. Where were we? We've got, in the lineup, not only JzG, but also Hipocrite and ScienceApologist. Enric Naval may or may not duck. This could be fun.

Last Chance.

[CharlotteWebb]

Well, I've never been much of a baseball fan, but my 9-year old daughter has taken to the Red Sox, so ... I've noticed myself starting to listen to the radio. It would be the Red Sox, of course, not the Phillies. My daughter would be horrified by anything else.

Now, about that Guy. Where were we? We've got, in the lineup, not only JzG, but also Hipocrite and ScienceApologist. Enric Naval may or may not duck. This could be fun.

Well aren't you the bearer of Bad News Bears.

[tarantino]

Now, about that Guy. Where were we? We've got, in the lineup, not only JzG, but also Hipocrite and ScienceApologist. Enric Naval may or may not duck. This could be fun.

Last Chance.

You mean Hipocrite,
JBKramer
DepartedUser
PouponOnToast
LegitAltAccount
Archfailure
Throwawayarb
MusingsOfAPrivateNature
MOASPN
CManW
Semiprivatemusings
Salmon of Doubt
64.95.38.193
63.85.198.113
32.141.254.27
32.139.65.55
32.139.106.170
32.142.56.176
32.136.61.1
32.142.72.230
32.141.138.133
32.139.193.65
32.136.157.224
32.136.92.97
32.136.216.22
etc.

Why do they allow him continue to participate?