Thatcher: Intentional Deceptive Argumentation, ...you gotta at least try, right? Options

[Piperdown]

Thatcher has now tried an old Mantanmoreland Jedi Mind Trick (check out MM's "they're socking, not me!" deceptive edits to claim other editors aren't talking about his socking, but someone else's):
http://www.antisocialmedia.net/Gary_Weiss_...ion_Debate.html

He is (dis)earnestly trying to characterise the Varkala Situation as being described as a Samiharris, not MM, correlation. Despite no mention of this anywhere.

Why?

Because Thatcher is desperate to save Mantanmoreland, and the Samiharris sock is already screwed. So let's blame the fart on the dog.

Unbelievable. Is this person really on an arbitration committee?

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=...oldid=191757539

::::::[[Wikipedia:Requests_for_arbitration/Mantanmoreland/Evidence#Conflict_of_interests|Varkala]]. There seem to be a few people willing to go along with the idea that maybe Samiharris was GW in real life but that Mantan is not. [[User talk:Thatcher|Thatcher]] 00:28, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

No there aren't. Not one person has "gone along with" that.

Thatcher, again, proves that people will say anything when they paint themselves into a corner with their own past lies. That is not a honest mistake.

What a joke.

And Gary is back on the "I'm a Defender Against Corporate POV Campaigns" horse.

Nevermind that no corporation has edited Naked Short Selling. I did. Against his two socks at the same time. From my house. I'm not a corporation. If I saw any "Corporate" (great word to stir up the college kids, gary!) I would have notified the COI page, as I did

Copper River

editing David Rocker. You're familiar with them, right Gary? Or as I did NBC editing NBC reporter bio's. Lol.

I also reported you, discreetly, by email, to Mr Hochman. But he was highly unmotivated, lol.

The "relata refero" guy is blowing up Gary's bullsh-t on the NSS talk page right now.

What did occur is a "Desperate Author Pumping His Book" Campaign. Gary is goin' down blazin'. Go gary! Where's Samiharris at?

This post has been edited by Piperdown:

[Kato]

These Arbcom shindigs just become swamped by anyone and everyone throwing in their two cents. It is an utterly appalling manner in which to settle disputes. And lets face it, this dispute is serious enough to have a big impact on at least two peoples' real world careers.

See number three of GlassBeadGame's Ten Reasons Why The Arbitration Committee Doesn’t Matter:

3) It encourages meddling and humiliation by allowing anyone to comment in disputes in which they have no standing and nothing relevant to contribute;

See also, my statement last week:

Why isn't this being handled by Arbcom? In the open -- with the parties including Judd, Mantamoreland and SamiHarris giving statements. And with the investigation given proper weight? And with no rabble of leering goons like Guy or GeorgeWilliamHerbert interjecting every 2 minutes to scream nonsense about "banned users" and "vile stalkers"??

Or why not deal with this as it is: A proper dispute in the real world? Treat is as such, and apply professional dispute resolution methods, rather than the ridiculous procedures Wikipedia currently employs. Current processes merely result in bawling, bullying and scandals that demean the project and everyone involved with it. Including us.

There are currently 24 people making statements on the Arbcom talk page, including the ridiculous GeorgeWilliamHerbert. Herbert concludes that despite Wordbomb's Weiss=Mantanmoreland theory being proved beyond reasonable doubt, and despite the sockpuppetry claims now being considered a formality, "Bagley's fundamental premise is therefore wrong". Herbert is without doubt the most cretinous meddler on the site. Every single thing he says is absolute bollocks.

[Piperdown]

the singlemost effective and truthful proceedings that have take place on this matter (and my block review) occurred when WIKIPEDIANS WHO WERE NEVER INVOLVED were shown the facts of the matter and allowed to freely speak to their conclusions.

When that occurred, over 20 editors opined on fozzie's investigation page that the sky is blue.

Those who have been involved in this situation before should be providing "evidence" and letting the truly neutral decide.

But neutrality is not WP's strong suit.

They're doing their best to call the sky green, and all of you knaves will submit to their royal declarations, lol.....

Those 1,841 emails are still hanging over this. It's not too late to start the truth-telling, all you Wikicrats.

This post has been edited by Piperdown:

[Amarkov]

Is GWH really suggesting that knowingly agreeing with a banned user is the same thing as proxying for them?

[The Wales Hunter]

I don't see that having "X" number of users making comments on the Arbcom talk pages is a bad thing. Surely the more than make comments, the more that will feel comfortable coming forward and making comments?

If it were just the usual crowd, it could turn the "neutral" off from the proceedings as they wouldn't want to get involved in battle between the "usual sides".

Just my view.

[Proabivouac]

::::::[[Wikipedia:Requests_for_arbitration/Mantanmoreland/Evidence#Conflict_of_interests|Varkala]]. There seem to be a few people willing to go along with the idea that maybe Samiharris was GW in real life but that Mantan is not. [[User talk:Thatcher|Thatcher]] 00:28, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

No there aren't. Not one person has "gone along with" that.

JzG has, as I posted here:
http://wikipediareview.com/index.php?showtopic=15875

[Kato]

Is GWH really suggesting that knowingly agreeing with a banned user is the same thing as proxying for them?

Herbert is off his face. Just follow his contributions on any number of subjects -- he makes Guy Chapman sound like Richard Dawkins. How on earth Herbert ascended to some higher chamber in Wikipedia's corridors of power I'll never know. At least with Slim and JoshuaZ, you have to admit that they're not stupid. Someone should put together a compilation of the best of Herbert, it'll sell out in no time.

[Piperdown]

::::::[[Wikipedia:Requests_for_arbitration/Mantanmoreland/Evidence#Conflict_of_interests|Varkala]]. There seem to be a few people willing to go along with the idea that maybe Samiharris was GW in real life but that Mantan is not. [[User talk:Thatcher|Thatcher]] 00:28, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

No there aren't. Not one person has "gone along with" that.

JzG has, as I posted here:
http://wikipediareview.com/index.php?showtopic=15875

Lol. Yeah, there's someone who can't read one diff and a Forbes byline. Idiot. Didn't he leave again?

[Kato]

I don't see that having "X" number of users making comments on the Arbcom talk pages is a bad thing.

If they've got evidence, then fine -- but if they're spewing a load of irrational half-baked opinions that could be accompanied by the Laurel and Hardy theme tune, then they should just get lost.

[The Wales Hunter]

GWH may have just seen the Varkala evidence, then...!

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=...oldid=191695532

Hmm... On first impression, that is a really striking bit of evidence re Varkala, yes. There could be other explanations, but it's pretty strong implication, and not really reasonably any sort of statistical fluke. Georgewilliamherbert (talk) 02:36, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

[Piperdown]

Is GWH really suggesting that knowingly agreeing with a banned user is the same thing as proxying for them?

Herbert is off his face. Just follow his contributions on any number of subjects -- he makes Guy Chapman sound like Richard Dawkins. How on earth Herbert ascended to some higher chamber in Wikipedia's corridors of power I'll never know. At least with Slim and JoshuaZ, you have to admit that they're not stupid. Someone should put together a compilation of the best of Herbert, it'll sell out in no time.

You have to concede one thing to Slim. There is no way in hell she will stand up and call the sky green. She'll decline to comment and have you taken away by the Stazi, but she's not one to volunteer public displays of disconnections with reality. GWH and JzG's are treasures of Wikipedia Review. You guys should put these two into a WR Hall of Fame. Complete with a long list, including GWH's wikien-l diamonds, of their best work. By best work I mean the many ways they can declare the sky green. It's endlessly entertaining, and should keep W-R in high traffic-cotton for years to come.

This post has been edited by Piperdown:

[Daniel]

Because Thatcher is desperate to save Mantanmoreland, and the Samiharris sock is already screwed. So let's blame the fart on the dog.

Unbelievable. Is this person really on an arbitration committee?

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=...oldid=191757539

No, Thatcher is not on the Arbitration Committee presently, although there's considerable support for him to run at the next election (and was at the last, as well).

-Daniel

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[Viridae]

People clutching at straws because they would be devestated to find out that those they dont like are actually right!

[Proabivouac]

Because Thatcher is desperate to save Mantanmoreland, and the Samiharris sock is already screwed. So let's blame the fart on the dog.

Unbelievable. Is this person really on an arbitration committee?

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=...oldid=191757539

No, Thatcher is not on the Arbitration Committee presently, although there's considerable support for him to run at the next election (and at the last, as well).

-Daniel

Thatcher was quite decent to me when arbitrolls Dmcdevit and Morven were breathing down my neck.

[Piperdown]

Thatcher was quite decent to me when arbitrolls Dmcdevit and Morven were breathing down my neck.

Another example of someone mistaking social networking with truth. Reminds me of the farcical "resolution" to my ban review.

At some point these admins are going to have to pretend these judicial proceedings shouldn't be popularity contests, who was nice, and "Survivor" reality show re-runs. You wonder why people get so upset. Children throwing spitballs at scholars.

You don't treat plaintiffs and defendants differently in court because they're your friends. You recuse yourself from the jury or the bench and let someone else put on the justice blindfold.

This post has been edited by Piperdown:

[Daniel]

Because Thatcher is desperate to save Mantanmoreland, and the Samiharris sock is already screwed. So let's blame the fart on the dog.

Unbelievable. Is this person really on an arbitration committee?

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=...oldid=191757539

No, Thatcher is not on the Arbitration Committee presently, although there's considerable support for him to run at the next election (and at the last, as well).

-Daniel

There's the on-WP Arb Dog & Pony Show committee and then there's the actual one. You know, the one that Jayjg, Slim, and Gerard are on.

Oh yes, of course. The likes of David Gerard, SlimVirgin and Jayjg certainly pull the strings; no doubt is left once you read the admonishment to David Gerard, the warning to SlimVirgin, and the public admonishment/reminder to Jayjg. Hrm. I didn't think these users were the self-admonishing types; or, at least, the Review's constant portrayal of them, their actions and their "attitudes" certainly doesn't make said connection easy to comprehend. Maybe I missed the latest dossier from the cabal about new tactics, though.

-Daniel

This post has been edited by Daniel:

[Piperdown]

and what was actually DONE to them, Daniel? nothing. it was a show.

Beyond that case, what was done to Slimmy's double voting sock? Lol. How about Jayjg's Oversight and "Allegations of" stunts? How about Gerard's serial DICK routine?

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[WordBomb]

GWH may have just seen the Varkala evidence, then...!

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=...oldid=191695532

Hmm... On first impression, that is a really striking bit of evidence re Varkala, yes. There could be other explanations, but it's pretty strong implication, and not really reasonably any sort of statistical fluke. Georgewilliamherbert (talk) 02:36, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

REPENT! REPENT! THE END IS NEAR!

Good thing I had no idea about that Varkala stuff. It was all figured out by other folks, so it's untainted by my WordBomb mojo.

[Piperdown]

It was all figured out by other folks, so it's untainted by my WordBomb mojo.

When I found your ASM site while googling gary (ooh that doesn't sound right), I didn't take any of it at face value. You had links, WP diffs, etc. I went and didn't trust, but verified all of what I concluded, myself.

That these Denny Colt morons on WP decided that people couldn't decide for themselves when pointed to facts we could all not trust but verify has been the funniest part of all this.

It's a Monty Python dead parrot sketch, and I've been watching it re-run for 10 months now.

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[The Wales Hunter]

I'll put my hands up here and now and admit I was skeptical, even a few days ago. Even not that many hours ago, even.

But as soon as this gorgeous Indian graph appeared, it all fell into place.

And all with publicly available evidence, which is always a good thing.

I feel bad about doubting but now completely relieved that WB has been vindicated.

And a thought...

When Vikings died they went to Valhalla but Mantanmore's credibility died at Varkala!

This post has been edited by The Wales Hunter: