Sir Fozzie's investigation, a proper sockpuppet report Options

[thekohser]

Jimbo gives his evidence:

Evidence presented by Jimbo Wales

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=...oldid=191555850

I have personally seen no persuasive evidence

...At times I have believed one way, at times I have believed another way. I have investigated the claims to the best of my ability and I have been unable to find proof one way or the other.

...What I said, at a point in time, was that I believed it to be true that Mantanmoreland == Gary Weiss. This was specifically in the context of a conversation in which I was trying to get more evidence... a proof, one way or the other. Me believing at a point in time in an investigation that something was true, is not the same thing as an assertion that it is true, nor of an "admission" or anything else.

...For these reasons, I do not believe it to be true that Mantanmoreland == Samiharris.

The only thing I learned from that post is that Jimbo admits to flip-flopping whenever he damn well pleases, he concedes that he's done it in the past, he professes that he's doing it now, and I therefore conclude he's likely at some point in the future to say something like...

"Come on, Gary, it has long been a known suspicion that you are Mantanmoreland, and I have firmly held this belief at numerous times during this ongoing affair."

Rule #1 of Wikipedia: Jimbo must always appear right.

Rule #2: When Jimbo's wrong, vacillate until Rule #1 is true again.

[WhispersOfWisdom]

So the evidence that (should) piece Weiss and Mantanmoreland together was freely available all along. On Weiss' own blog and on Wiki. Wonder what Jimbo will have to say about all of this? And it was Jimbo who mentioned Weiss in his evidence, it looked like others were going to just focus on socks.

Jimmy says: "Oh the humanity!"

WR will rescue the sanity of many that are still out there at WP...trying so desperately to hang on to the last bastion of super secret sleuthing. Eventually even JzG will succumb to the gravity of a fool’s game. (The kids are still in the sand box, playing with what they think is clay...when in reality it is animal excrement.)

This post has been edited by WhispersOfWisdom: Fri 15th February 2008, 9:31pm

[papaya]

I have to say that the India graph is a brilliant bit of presentation. But I don't think Jimbo's "evidence" means anything other than the assertion/admission that he doesn't have any evidence to give.

[WhispersOfWisdom]

I have to say that the India graph is a brilliant bit of presentation. But I don't think Jimbo's "evidence" means anything other than the assertion/admission that he doesn't have any evidence to give.

It is, in fact, but one of hundreds of pieces of evidence that, when taken together, offer more proof than any of the other super sleuthing cases that have been presented to date.

Only one reason (noun) why this is not cut and dry and open and shut.

Money.

[LamontStormstar]

Rule #1 of Wikipedia: Jimbo must always appear right.

Rule #2: When Jimbo's wrong, vacillate until Rule #1 is true again.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fight_Club#Plot_summary


Fight club style:

Rule #1: You don't talk about Jimbo being wrong.
Rule #2: You don't talk about Jimbo being wrong
Rule #3: When someone declares a wikibreak or that they're retiring, even if they're just faking it, you don't block them.
Rule #4: Only two people to an edit war.
Rule #5: One edit war at a time.
Rule #6: They edit war without hiding behind proxies or sock puppets.
Rule #7: The edit wars go on as long as they have to.
Rule #8: If this is your first time at Wikipedia, you have to edit war.

This post has been edited by LamontStormstar: Sat 16th February 2008, 12:35am

[Somey]

This just in, from Gary Weiss's personal blog ("telegenic lifelong bachelor" refers to Patrick Byrne):

http://garyweiss.blogspot.com/2008/02/vict...own-one-to.html

The telegenic lifelong bachelor has boasted on his blog about having "8,000" emails demonstrating his various conspiracy theories -- including "1,841" from me that, as he describes them, would be forged if they are not figments of Byrne's lurid imagination. The SEC needs to subpoena those "emails" in its ongoing probe, and include this sordid company's pretexting and smear campaign in whatever action it eventually takes.

At least one forged email was offered up to a reporter for The Register, an Internet tabloid, who was researching a hatchet job on Wikipedia. The SEC needs to find out who forged those emails (as if we didn't know) and make an appropriate criminal referral.

So it seems that he's going to claim that the e-mails purporting to be from him, and mentioning his WP editing activities, are faked. I'm not surprised, but e-mails can also be verified by their recipients - if he chooses to make a case out of this, he could be in some very serious trouble if anyone is willing to go on record. False accusations of forgery are about as clear a case of libel as you can get, at least on the internet.

We really need a "rubbing hands in glee" emoticon here, don't we?

[Amarkov]

Do people on Wikipedia live in a vacuum, or something? They don't seem to understand how bizzare it seems to everyone else when they declare El Reg an "Internet tabloid".

[Proabivouac]

So it seems that he's going to claim that the e-mails purporting to be from him, and mentioning his WP editing activities, are faked.

They must be quite damning, if he already knows they're fake.

[WordBomb]

We really need a "rubbing hands in glee" emoticon here, don't we?

Speak for yourself. I spent three weeks of my life reading and sorting EVERY ONE OF THOSE 8,000 EMAILS.

1% were spectacular
9% were enlightening
90% were mind-numbing

However I will say this: in private email, Gary Weiss actually comes off as a human...nothing like the mouthbreather who writes his blog and edits Wikipedia as Mantanmoreland and Samiharris.

And had he not made it clear that he is in fact Mantanmoreland, I might be made to wonder.

[The Wales Hunter]

And had he not made it clear that he is in fact Mantanmoreland, I might be made to wonder.

How clear is "clear," out of interest?

[WordBomb]

And had he not made it clear that he is in fact Mantanmoreland, I might be made to wonder.

How clear is "clear," out of interest?

Clear as in "Hey look at what I just did on the Wikipedia article on naked short selling one minute ago...isn't that great?" and then you look at the edit history for the article and see only Mantanmoreland edits within several hours of the email.

Then there are many others like this: "Blah blah blah I'm Gary Weiss blah blah irrelevant irrelevant blah blah today is April 29, 2006 blah blah."

Then, examining the headers (they all came with full headers! Joy!) you see his IP address on that day was 151.202.91.28. Now, go take a look at what that tells us.

[Proabivouac]

And had he not made it clear that he is in fact Mantanmoreland, I might be made to wonder.

How clear is "clear," out of interest?

Clear as in "Hey look at what I just did on the Wikipedia article on naked short selling one minute ago...isn't that great?" and then you look at the edit history for the article and see only Mantanmoreland edits within several hours of the email.

Then there are many others like this: "Blah blah blah I'm Gary Weiss blah blah irrelevant irrelevant blah blah today is April 29, 2006 blah blah."

Then, examining the headers (they all came with full headers! Joy!) you see his IP address on that day was 151.202.91.28. Now, go take a look at what that tells us.

At this point, Mantanmoreland coudl freely admit that he's Weiss, and Samiharris is his sock, and some would still be saying, it's not true, he did it under pressure, Jimbo and JzG and the "cabal" can't be wrong.

Jimbo, JzG, "cabal": you've been had.

[Aloft]

Well, Mantanmoreland has presented his "evidence." It's a rambling screed in which he says that he's not guilty. It looks to be pretty much the same as what Jimbo and JzG posted. No actual evidence, just hand waving about trolls, stalkers, Judd Bagley, they're all out to get me, etc. He's been reading the book "How to 'Play the Victim' For Dummies" by L. Mack.

Is "smear" his favorite word or something? I'd love to see an analysis of how often GaryMantanSamiTomLastmorelandharrisstonerexitWeiss uses that word.

This post has been edited by Aloft: Sun 17th February 2008, 12:21am

[Error59]

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Req..._Mantanmoreland

This case reads like some kind of appendix to Wikipedia Review or Overstock.com's antisocialmedia.net website

Nice - three BADSITES in one sentence with no actual point to their being mentioned. Is that a record?

[One]

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Req..._Mantanmoreland

This case reads like some kind of appendix to Wikipedia Review or Overstock.com's antisocialmedia.net website

Nice - three BADSITES in one sentence with no actual point to their being mentioned. Is that a record?

Heh. And to think of all the times he revert warred to remove "antisocialmedia.net" too.

Classy how he doesn't address the damning evidence that he's Gary Weiss. And that he references Jimbo's "I think they're separate" "evidence" by saying "Jimbo thinks we're separate!"

[WordBomb]

Just a quick note...it seems some of the Gary Weiss India theories emerging assume that he got married during his October, 2006 trip to India. In fact, he was married two or three years earlier.

It appears Weiss goes on annual, month-long trips to India, usually in autumn.

Look at CHL's graph and the comparatively barren (though not time-shifted) editing period exactly one year after the now-famous 10/2006 circadian inversion.

Now note the series of impending travel-related posts made by Weiss (as Daveumansky) on the indiamike.com forums in early 10/2004. In them, he references at least one earlier trip to India.

If you're curious, you might consider reading this to know how I know that Weiss was "daveumansky".

[Moulton]

"Oh what a tangled web we weave, when first we practice to deceive." --Proverb

"Be ye not bamboozled." --The Big Bamboozler

[guy]

"Oh what a tangled web we weave, when first we practice to deceive." --Proverb

I don't think that's a proverb but a quote from Walter Scott. Why can you never find a Wikiquote bureaucrat when you need one?