Abd-William M. Connolley, The Cabal strikes back Options

[The Adversary]

What are you talking about? I am calm and well-behaved in these forums --

Oh, so you already are castrated? Splendid!

[A Horse With No Name]

What are you talking about? I am calm and well-behaved in these forums --

Oh, so you already are castrated? Splendid!

Ha ha...not. But that's why this Horsey likes to run with Malleus, Giano and Kohs -- stallions with balls of thunder to shake things up in the Wiki-stable.

[The Adversary]

Ha ha...not. But that's why this Horsey likes to run with Malleus, Giano and Kohs -- stallions with balls of thunder to shake things up in the Wiki-stable.

You forgot a tiny issue (for you): those guys have this. You, running around making the same old "joke" for the 222nd time; not so. At least you have yet to show it.

So therefore; vets!! Knives!

Time for a role-change?

[A Horse With No Name]

You forgot a tiny issue (for you): those guys have this. You, running around making the same old "joke" for the 222nd time; not so. At least you have yet to show it.

Well, I don't want to overshadow them, of course.

Besides, we are distracting from Abd and WMC -- balls, brains, what? I put my oats on Abd. He's a classic screwball and I gotta love him for being so much fun.

This post has been edited by A Horse With No Name: Mon 20th July 2009, 7:36pm

[Abd]

How incredibly boring, I come here looking for some real poop and nothing but Mathsci Math****ing, which, frankly, is of low interest. Nothing to inspire me to my usual walls-o-text. Wasted a few minutes. Here people complain about WMC for months or years, and when someone does something about it, like take a case to ArbComm that gets accepted, and has the -- ahem, well I do have five bio kids, which implies something -- to actually say the secret word, CABAL, in full view of the community, and this is all you can come up with? I'm ashamed. Mathsci, you have some weird inversion here. On-WP, you are dense with incivility, here, you are all pleasantries and smileys. Far out. People are more complicated than cartoons, or perhaps merely devious.

By the way, I do not consider posting of anonymous evidence and proposals at RfAr to be any kind of support. If nobody is willing to risk their "real" wikineck to say it, it's worthless, politically, and just makes the natives restless for no good cause.

This post has been edited by Abd: Mon 20th July 2009, 8:08pm

[Somey]

How incredibly boring, I come here looking for some real poop and nothing but Mathsci Math****ing, which, frankly, is of low interest.

Low interest? About 75 percent of this thread is of no interest whatsoever.

Maybe someone could summarize what the point of all this is? For the benefit of people who don't spend most of their time monitoring WP:ANI and the ArbCom pages? If not, I'm sorely tempted to just delete everything after the first post, so we can all start over.

[The Adversary]

Low interest? About 75 percent of this thread is of no interest whatsoever.
<snip>
If not, I'm sorely tempted to just delete everything after the first post, so we can all start over.

Absolutely.
The problem is that a general dislike of Horsey´s sexist comments have been building up over these last weeks/months. At least in me! Just by chance it happend that this thread was were things exploded....you should probably delete it, or better: send Horsey and me to the tarpit: I am NOT finished with him yet... Grrr.

[GlassBeadGame]

Low interest? About 75 percent of this thread is of no interest whatsoever.
<snip>
If not, I'm sorely tempted to just delete everything after the first post, so we can all start over.

Absolutely.
The problem is that a general dislike of Horsey´s sexist comments have been building up over these last weeks/months. At least in me! Just by chance it happend that this thread was were things exploded....you should probably delete it, or better: send Horsey and me to the tarpit: I am NOT finished with him yet... Grrr.

Mr. Horse seems to make a good number of comments working in reference to how attractive he finds certain female participants (and actually a couple of male ones also.) I've pondered if this was "harassment" or not, especially when the comments are repeated into a pattern. But the comments are not at all graphic and AFAIK no one on the receiving end has complained. If I received such a complaint I would argue with other mods/staff that this should be somehow formally discouraged. Otherwise I'll just sit on my concerns.

[The Adversary]

Mr. Horse seems to make a good number of comments working in reference to how attractive he finds certain female participants (and actually a couple of male ones also.) I've pondered if this was "harassment" or not, especially when the comments are repeated into a pattern. But the comments are not at all graphic and AFAIK no one on the receiving end has complained. If I received such a complaint I would argue with other mods/staff that this should be somehow formally discouraged. Otherwise I'll just sit on my concerns.

Oh, I don´t want you to ban him, I just would like an arena where I can deal with him, if you see what I mean.

[sbrown]

Mr. Horse seems to make a good number of comments working in reference to how attractive he finds certain female participants (and actually a couple of male ones also.)

Yes its highly irritating. Fortunately he hasnt noticed me yet so I shant make a formal protest.

[Lar]

Oh, I don´t want you to ban him, I just would like an arena where I can deal with him, if you see what I mean.

Doesn't sound like a fair fight to me. Poor horsey would be SO outclassed.

[Cla68]

How incredibly boring, I come here looking for some real poop and nothing but Mathsci Math****ing, which, frankly, is of low interest. Nothing to inspire me to my usual walls-o-text. Wasted a few minutes. Here people complain about WMC for months or years, and when someone does something about it, like take a case to ArbComm that gets accepted, and has the -- ahem, well I do have five bio kids, which implies something -- to actually say the secret word, CABAL, in full view of the community, and this is all you can come up with? I'm ashamed. Mathsci, you have some weird inversion here. On-WP, you are dense with incivility, here, you are all pleasantries and smileys. Far out. People are more complicated than cartoons, or perhaps merely devious.

By the way, I do not consider posting of anonymous evidence and proposals at RfAr to be any kind of support. If nobody is willing to risk their "real" wikineck to say it, it's worthless, politically, and just makes the natives restless for no good cause.

ABD, what do you want from the RfAR? For WMC to be banned or desysopped? Or neither? I personally feel that WMC shouldn't be an admin, because he's rude, condescending, arbitrary, and pushes POV. I don't, however, at this moment have the DIFFS to back this up because I haven't put in the hours to dig them up. If you want WMC's behavior to be corrected, you're going to need to put in the hours and present the evidence. It will probably take you a few days of work, but that's how it goes. Some participants here may help you out a little by posting incidents and diffs that they remember as they watch you work, but you'll need to get the ball rolling if this is important to you.

Also, if you're going to say that there is a cabal at work, you'll need to build your case with evidence.

This post has been edited by Cla68: Tue 21st July 2009, 1:53am

[A Horse With No Name]

Oh, I don´t want you to ban him, I just would like an arena where I can deal with him, if you see what I mean.

Ah, come on, loosen up. Come here, ya big Adversary, you deserve a Horsey kiss.

How incredibly boring, I come here looking for some real poop and nothing but Mathsci Math****ing, which, frankly, is of low interest. Nothing to inspire me to my usual walls-o-text.

Hey Abd, nice to see you standing up for NYScholar. I think you are the only friend that she has left on Wikipedia.

[tarantino]

Oh, I don´t want you to ban him, I just would like an arena where I can deal with him, if you see what I mean.

Doesn't sound like a fair fight to me. Poor horsey would be SO outclassed.

Horsey is a one trick pony. He really needs to take some lessons from Obesity or bottled spider to get out of his rut, but he's probably intellectually incapable of learning from those masters.

[Mathsci]

How incredibly boring, I come here looking for some real poop and nothing but Mathsci Math****ing, which, frankly, is of low interest. Nothing to inspire me to my usual walls-o-text. Wasted a few minutes. Here people complain about WMC for months or years, and when someone does something about it, like take a case to ArbComm that gets accepted, and has the -- ahem, well I do have five bio kids, which implies something -- to actually say the secret word, CABAL, in full view of the community, and this is all you can come up with? I'm ashamed. Mathsci, you have some weird inversion here. On-WP, you are dense with incivility, here, you are all pleasantries and smileys. Far out. People are more complicated than cartoons, or perhaps merely devious.

By the way, I do not consider posting of anonymous evidence and proposals at RfAr to be any kind of support. If nobody is willing to risk their "real" wikineck to say it, it's worthless, politically, and just makes the natives restless for no good cause.

During an ArbCom case where everything is pure invention, how refreshing to come to WR where the real truth can be spoken.

The smileys here are indeed mega-brilliant, even wicked.

Here's one to use on the workshop page when a clerk claims you're telling leetle porkies.

Naughty, naughty clerk.

[Mathsci]

If you want WMC's behavior to be corrected, you're going to need to put in the hours and present the evidence. It will probably take you a few days of work, but that's how it goes. Some participants here may help you out a little by posting incidents and diffs that they remember as they watch you work, but you'll need to get the ball rolling if this is important to you.

Also, if you're going to say that there is a cabal at work, you'll need to build your case with evidence.

Isn't the case a little more restricted than you're implying? It's not an RfC on William M. Connolley.

This post has been edited by Mathsci: Tue 21st July 2009, 2:19am

[Lar]

Horsey is a one trick pony.

I couldn't have said it better myself.

He really needs to take some lessons from Obesity or bottled spider to get out of his rut, but he's probably intellectually incapable of learning from those masters.

I think you're selling him a bit short. What I can't figure out is whether there's one user or two inside the horse costume, though.

[Milton Roe]

Horsey is a one trick pony.

I couldn't have said it better myself.

He really needs to take some lessons from Obesity or bottled spider to get out of his rut, but he's probably intellectually incapable of learning from those masters.

I think you're selling him a bit short. What I can't figure out is whether there's one user or two inside the horse costume, though.

If there's two, one has his face in the others' bum. This would explain 50% of posts!

[Malleus]

Ha ha...not. But that's why this Horsey likes to run with Malleus, Giano and Kohs -- stallions with balls of thunder to shake things up in the Wiki-stable.

You forgot a tiny issue (for you): those guys have this. You, running around making the same old "joke" for the 222nd time; not so. At least you have yet to show it.

So therefore; vets!! Knives!

Time for a role-change?

Speaking only for myself, of course, I would be rather upset if anything I said was considered to be sexist. I pride myself on being even-handedly obnoxious to both males and females.

This post has been edited by Malleus: Tue 21st July 2009, 3:53am

[Abd]

Okay, finally, something to chew on.

ABD, what do you want from the RfAR? For WMC to be banned or desysopped? Or neither?

Are those the only choices. Let me think?

Neither. Both would be rude, don't you think?

Fortunately, it's not up to me. My job is just to make clear what happened on my watch.

I personally feel that WMC shouldn't be an admin, because he's rude, condescending, arbitrary, and pushes POV.

Unlike anyone else, right? The problem with WMC isn't exactly WMC, he's just who he is, pretty transparent. The problem is a community that isn't paying attention and isn't capable of figuring out how to pay attention because it's too distracted with whatever, and can't be bothered to read explanations of what, indeed, might be done. Guess what? It might take more discussion than trading clever sound bites.

I don't, however, at this moment have the DIFFS to back this up because I haven't put in the hours to dig them up. If you want WMC's behavior to be corrected, you're going to need to put in the hours and present the evidence.

No shit! You mean I can't just state what I know and everyone will AGF and they will check it out for themselves? Why not? Don't people fucking care? Maybe I could reconsider. Can I revert the entire RfAr back to the beginning? All those cabal editors have been reverting, why can't I have fun too?

Did you see the amazing sequence today with Short Brigade Harvester Boris? He is the best proof that, if "cabal" means "organized conspiracy," it doesn't exist or is toothless and with no discipline at all. He takes my list of editors who voted a certain way in certain discussions, and notifies them all that they have been "mentioned" at ArbComm, never mind numerous disclaimers that these are just lists and don't constitute accusations of misbehavior. The clerk supports it. So I asked, does this mean that if I put the names of the opposing voters in those discussions, I can notify them too?

It might seem even funnier if you look at the original discussions and notice the names on the other side. Two sitting arbitrators. Durova. And quite a few other interesting names.... Basically Boris set it up so that I can canvass, or the clerks are going to have some serious egg-on-face, one or the other.

And it gets funnier. I tried to add Hipocrite as a party, and notified him. WMC edit warred to remove Hipocrites' name from the case, same as Mathsci previously removed his own name. The clerks have issued several last-warning, we will block anyone who removes content from the RfAr. Until the next incident, where they then give another strict warning.

So Raul654 removes an alleged sock's evidence and proposals. The clerk "warns" Raul654, but it was a whole lot wimpier than the word "warn" implies. And, certainly, the clerk wants to make it clear, Raul should continue with "happy editing." The arbs knew that this case would be messy, but apparently, they didn't fortify the clerks....

Anyway, WMC also removed my notice to Hipocrite. Rootology reverted him. He reverted Rootology. Rootology retired. So here comes Boris, notifying everyone on the alleged cabal lists. Boris notifies Hipocrite, thus effectively undoing WMC's quite BOLD revert warring. Stay tuned: Will WMC revert Boris? Will Boris revert himself, thus undermining his argument that all these people should be notified? Will Abd continue to bury himself with claims of cabal cabal cabal, without a shred of evidence?

I wish I knew, myself. But, then again, that would be boring, wouldn't it? Really, WMC is the only admin who has had the guts to block someone for being "boring." I kid you not. We need more like him, not less.

However, he should not be allowed to block for more than 24 hours, and he should not be allowed near heavy machinery, and his testimony should be placed only a few notches above that of Raul654 as to reliability.

Back to Advice I Did Not Need

It will probably take you a few days of work, but that's how it goes. Some participants here may help you out a little by posting incidents and diffs that they remember as they watch you work, but you'll need to get the ball rolling if this is important to you.

[Seriously, for a moment, real evidence is welcome, but I'd rather it be presented directly by editors. Have some guts. Raul654 only has power because hardly anyone stands up to him. And, please, be careful, try to stay focused on, I'd suggest, evidence of failure to recuse, or of preferential treatment of favored editors, and only pick clear cases and recent ones. Otherwise it will be worse than useless.]

Obviously Cla68 is not a serious student of Abd Thought, my favorite essay is WP:DGAF.

Also, if you're going to say that there is a cabal at work, you'll need to build your case with evidence.

With evidence? Didn't you already say that? I'd rather build a case with treacle and bread-and-butterflies. And store useless junk in it. Look, everyone here knows that there is a cabal, except Mathsci pretends not to. Or maybe he actually is that dumb. It's all over the media. All I did was to say it.

Yeah, and if I don't prove it, I'm history, though in the MfD for WP:JURY the other day, I wrote that we should have an essay titled WP:Pull Your Pants Up. It would be about what to do when you realize you've mooned the jury. Think fast! Sorry, I ran out of bupropion, I don't know what I was thinking, there is no cabal, no siree! What a huge mistake! Here, Raul, let me clean your boots or something. Sorry sorry sorry.

Nah, I'll just let if fall where it falls. If I mooned the jury, I will pull up my pants as soon as I realize they are down. But that's about it. I have a history of pulling tricks out of the fire, but, I never know exactly how it will happen. It will or it won't. I used to say, when I'd be on stage and didn't have the foggiest idea what to do, "If I'm a fool, God, I'm your fool." And then something would happen. Usually! I don't own it.

It's called "improv" folks. WMC does the same, only he is, perhaps, a little less considerate, and not a lot more than half my age. And probably not as smart, nor as deep. But so what? It takes all kinds.

Damn d-amphetamine, here it is 2 AM and I didn't even notice.