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> Cold fusion, Why not?
Abd
post Mon 14th September 2009, 6:12pm
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I'll just start this with a whimper, not a bang. JzG, the big meanie, just removed Yet Another Link to lenr-canr.org from Cold fusion. Waaa! Teacher told him not to do that! I'm going to take my marbles home! Now that I'm banned, I get to whine all I want! It's kinda fun!

No discussion, he gave the same argument that was discussed to death at Martin Fleischmann (T-H-L-K-D), that was discussed to death at MediaWiki talk:Whitelist, and always, in the end, rejected.

Pure wikilawyering: there is zero legal risk to Wikipedia from linking to that paper, the web site claims permission for all that it hosts, and if there is a defect with a couple of pages, it's basically irrelevant. (Very different situation with newenergytimes.com, they host under a claim of fair use, which they can get away with as a nonprofit until the publisher squawks.) The specific paper he delinked was approved by Beetstra at the whitelist page, after all the objections had been raised about copyright.

Ban the cat, the place is overrun with mice. Kind of cute, aren't they?

Wikipedia, you traded Abd and WMC's bit for JzG and Hipocrite. Enjoy.
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Herschelkrustofsky
post Mon 5th October 2009, 9:01pm
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FYI:
QUOTE
Deuteron Theory of Cold Fusion Proposed in Rome

Oct. 5 (LPAC)--A new theory of cold fusion is being proposed at an international conference currently underway in Rome, according to an advance report from radiochemist and materials expert Dr. Edmund Storms.

Dr. Storms believes that clusters of deuterons (the nuclei of the naturally occurring isotope of hydrogen) are able to penetrate the nucleus of palladium, transmuting it into a heavier element and releasing energy in the form of heat. The deuteron clusters, perhaps similar to Rydberg clusters, are charge-free configurations that are not repelled by the positive charge of the palladium nucleus. According to Storms' research, the reaction occurs not within the palladium crystal lattice, but in nano-particles of palladium mixed with other elements that form at the surface of the palladium cathode.

There is no unstable intermediate nucleus, and thus no radioactivity, released in the reaction. The absorption of deuterons produces an element of higher atomic number and mass, each deuteron releasing about 12 MeV of energy due to the mass defect.

According to Storms, who has been pursuing cold fusion since his retirement from Los Alamos National Laboratory in the early 1990s, his theory can explain all the known phenomena reported in cold fusion experiments to date. He believes it may also be the explanation for nuclear transmutation in biological systems first documented by Louis Kevran and subsequently pursued by researchers in Japan and Russia. Recently the Japanese have detected biological transmutation using nuclear magnetic resonance (NMR) techniques that are more reliable than chemical analysis, Storms says. Russian researchers have shown transmutation by bacteria capable of reproducing in 100% heavy water (deuterium in place of the hydrogen).

Storms's idea also has implications for the theory of nucleosynthesis. According to prevailing theory, the heavy elements must be produced in a neutron star, such as is hypothesized to be associated with a supernova. However, a process of cold fusion by incorporation of deuteron clusters could account for the production of heavier elements from lighter ones, without the need for highly energetic systems which would likely be detrimental to life. Such a process might even be occurring within the Earth's crust. [1]
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Abd
post Mon 5th October 2009, 10:03pm
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LaRouche Political Action Committee is the source, so this isn't exactly usable yet on Wikipedia! But I'll comment on the science.
QUOTE(Herschelkrustofsky @ Mon 5th October 2009, 5:01pm) *
FYI:

Deuteron Theory of Cold Fusion Proposed in Rome

Oct. 5 (LPAC)--A new theory of cold fusion is being proposed at an international conference currently underway in Rome, according to an advance report from radiochemist and materials expert Dr. Edmund Storms.

Dr. Storms believes that clusters of deuterons (the nuclei of the naturally occurring isotope of hydrogen) are able to penetrate the nucleus of palladium, transmuting it into a heavier element and releasing energy in the form of heat. The deuteron clusters, perhaps similar to Rydberg clusters, are charge-free configurations that are not repelled by the positive charge of the palladium nucleus. According to Storms' research, the reaction occurs not within the palladium crystal lattice, but in nano-particles of palladium mixed with other elements that form at the surface of the palladium cathode.
There are other current theories that involve Bose-Einstein condensates which function similarly. Takahashi's Tetrahedral Symmetric Condensate, formed from two deuterium molecules under lattice confinment, which must be at the surface, since deuterium in molecular form cannot penetrate far into the lattice, it dissociates, is postulated to do two things: form Be-8, which is unstable and immediate decays into two alpha particles at 23.8 MeV each, avoiding the conservation of momentum problem, the branching ratio, and the lack of gamma radiation, but still forming helium (i.e., alpha particles), but it is also expected that it would transmute palladium, because the BEC is capable of, as the article notes, approaching a palladium nucleus. If it can get there before it decays!
QUOTE
There is no unstable intermediate nucleus, and thus no radioactivity, released in the reaction. The absorption of deuterons produces an element of higher atomic number and mass, each deuteron releasing about 12 MeV of energy due to the mass defect.
This can't be the complete explanation, but there is, in fact, radioactivity; further, Storms himself has reviewed the literature in his Science of Low Energy Nuclear Reaction (World Scientific, 2007) and reports, from many studies, 25+/-5 MeV/He-4, which is consistent with a process that takes deuterium in and outputs helium (such as Takahashi's process would do, mostly).
QUOTE
According to Storms, who has been pursuing cold fusion since his retirement from Los Alamos National Laboratory in the early 1990s, his theory can explain all the known phenomena reported in cold fusion experiments to date. He believes it may also be the explanation for nuclear transmutation in biological systems first documented by Louis Kevran and subsequently pursued by researchers in Japan and Russia. Recently the Japanese have detected biological transmutation using nuclear magnetic resonance (NMR) techniques that are more reliable than chemical analysis, Storms says. Russian researchers have shown transmutation by bacteria capable of reproducing in 100% heavy water (deuterium in place of the hydrogen).
This report may be a bit garbled, or not, because I'm certainly not aware of all the work. I do know the Russian work, it is Vyosotskii, and it's stunning. The bacteria are various, but they include the really cool deinococcus radiodurans, which is astonishingly resistant to radiation damage, and which does appear to produce Fe-57 from manganese, as shown by Mossbauer spectroscopy. Vyosotskii's report is credible, on the face, but unconfirmed, and, yes, the implications are great. Because Vyosotskii is covered in reliable secondary source, WP should cover the work, but, of course, noting it as unconfirmed. It's notable. Now, if the Japanese have confirmed Vyosotskii, this would be important news. But I'm a bit suspicious that the report has been garbled. I was unable to find any document released by Storms, but maybe it hasn't hit the web. The Rome conference, ICCF-15, also known as the 15th International Conference on Condensed Matter Nuclear Science, just started today. The prepublished abstracts are hosted by ENEA, the Italian National Agency for New Technologies, Energy, and the Environment. Yes, Virginia, the Italian government supports cold fusion research. I was unable to find any reference in the abstracts to a new theory by Storms. Storms has generally said that no theory accounts for all the known phenomena. Cold fusion theory remains an entirely open question, with continued publication of theories, some of which approach explanatory power, but none of which have been confirmed sufficiently to see any wide acceptance.
QUOTE
Storms's idea also has implications for the theory of nucleosynthesis. According to prevailing theory, the heavy elements must be produced in a neutron star, such as is hypothesized to be associated with a supernova. However, a process of cold fusion by incorporation of deuteron clusters could account for the production of heavier elements from lighter ones, without the need for highly energetic systems which would likely be detrimental to life. Such a process might even be occurring within the Earth's crust. [1]
Speculation. Sure. I consider the phenomena to be adequately established to start to make it reasonable to speculate on this level. However, it is insufficiently characterized to have much confidence in any predictions. Turns out, folks, we have some things to study and learn. I'm going to be happy if I can manage to replicate -- and sell kits to replicate -- an experiment that has already been replicated by a half-dozen groups, maybe half of them amateur, if I can coax some alpha radiation from a place where it shouldn't be, by classical theory, and even a few stray neutrons, as have been reported. In my kitchen. I'll certainly let you folks know.
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Posts in this topic
Abd   Cold fusion   Mon 14th September 2009, 6:12pm
Apathetic   Isn't this basically the same as the post you ...   Mon 14th September 2009, 6:15pm
Abd   Isn't this basically the same as the post you ...   Mon 14th September 2009, 7:35pm
Appleby   Cold fusion is a spectacular example of the proble...   Mon 14th September 2009, 8:05pm
Eva Destruction   Cold fusion is a spectacular example of the probl...   Mon 14th September 2009, 8:19pm
Peter Damian   [quote name='Appleby' post='194151' date='Mon 14t...   Mon 14th September 2009, 8:39pm
One   Not before quite a few previously sane people wer...   Mon 14th September 2009, 8:56pm
Abd   Cold fusion is a spectacular example of the probl...   Mon 14th September 2009, 10:48pm
Milton Roe   It may be important to recognize that many workin...   Tue 15th September 2009, 2:18am
Abd   If there is this large isotope effect between deu...   Tue 15th September 2009, 3:10am
Angela Kennedy   But, back to the first question here: what is the...   Tue 15th September 2009, 3:23pm
Moulton   It would be better if WP wrote the shortest articl...   Tue 15th September 2009, 3:33pm
Abd   [quote name='Angela Kennedy' post='194292' date='T...   Wed 16th September 2009, 2:40am
Abd   [quote name='Abd' post='194228' date='Tue 15th Sep...   Tue 15th September 2009, 7:52pm
Milton Roe   If there is this large isotope effect between de...   Tue 15th September 2009, 6:19pm
Moulton   If you can't repeat your findings all the time...   Tue 15th September 2009, 6:25pm
Abd   [quote name='Abd' post='194228' date='Mon 14th Sep...   Wed 16th September 2009, 2:11am
Abd   Example of recent presentation by SPAWAR group (U....   Tue 15th September 2009, 1:59pm
Moulton   In contentious areas, the probability of consensus...   Wed 16th September 2009, 2:45am
EricBarbour   If only we gave out barnstars here. Abd would have...   Wed 16th September 2009, 2:58am
Abd   If only we gave out barnstars here. Abd would have...   Wed 16th September 2009, 3:23am
GlassBeadGame   If only we gave out barnstars here. Abd would hav...   Wed 16th September 2009, 3:01pm
Moulton   I'm convinced, more than ever, that smoke and ...   Wed 16th September 2009, 11:30am
GlassBeadGame   I'm convinced, more than ever, that smoke and...   Wed 16th September 2009, 6:45pm
Moulton   "Be Ye Not Bamboozled." —The Big Bambo...   Wed 16th September 2009, 3:06pm
Abd   I came across this peer-reviewed secondary source ...   Sat 19th September 2009, 6:17pm
Herschelkrustofsky   FYI:   Mon 5th October 2009, 9:01pm
Abd   LaRouche Political Action Committee is the source,...   Mon 5th October 2009, 10:03pm
Abd   In a thread where it's irrelevant, Mathsci pos...   Sat 10th October 2009, 5:52pm
Mathsci   <snip> and on and on.... <snip> I h...   Tue 20th October 2009, 3:44pm
Abd   I hope Abd's kitchen is properly insured agai...   Fri 23rd October 2009, 12:46am
GlassBeadGame   [quote name='Mathsci' post='200610' date='Tue 20t...   Fri 23rd October 2009, 12:59am
Abd   Good to know there is only one known fatality fro...   Fri 23rd October 2009, 1:40am
GlassBeadGame   [quote name='GlassBeadGame' post='201132' date='T...   Fri 23rd October 2009, 1:45am
Abd   I have a history of doing weird stuff, outside the...   Fri 23rd October 2009, 2:37am
Abd   The editing of the article is as silly as ever. Hi...   Tue 10th November 2009, 12:40am
Herschelkrustofsky   How long is it going to take before all this hits...   Tue 10th November 2009, 7:12am
Angela Kennedy   How long is it going to take before all this hit...   Tue 10th November 2009, 8:02am
Peter Damian   Meanwhile, on the cold fusion kitchen kit projec...   Tue 10th November 2009, 11:20am
Abd   I'm moving this discussion from where it is us...   Mon 19th October 2009, 4:03pm
GlassBeadGame   ... 5,267 words ... This might be a record of...   Tue 20th October 2009, 6:39pm
Cedric   [quote name='Abd' post='200426' date='Mon 19th Oc...   Wed 21st October 2009, 1:28am
Abd   A little knowledge is a dangerous thing, which is ...   Mon 7th December 2009, 5:59am
GlassBeadGame   Progress report: I have all the materials for th...   Mon 7th December 2009, 3:40pm
Abd   Progress report[...] Glad to know you're stil...   Tue 8th December 2009, 4:34am
Milton Roe   In fact, when I was a teenager, my friends and I ...   Tue 8th December 2009, 4:56am
One   Not considered a hazardous material, not seriousl...   Mon 7th December 2009, 4:17pm
Random832   Well, it's just denser water, so I wouldn...   Mon 7th December 2009, 4:47pm
One   [quote name='One' post='208758' date='Mon 7th Dec...   Mon 7th December 2009, 6:11pm
Random832   What a moronic hypothetical. Consider for exampl...   Mon 7th December 2009, 6:26pm
One   Wouldn't it make sense to track the substance...   Mon 7th December 2009, 6:42pm
Milton Roe   Wouldn't it make sense to track the substanc...   Mon 7th December 2009, 7:41pm
Abd   Anyway, if somebody even does a half-assed job of ...   Tue 8th December 2009, 4:49am
Abd   I just find it strange that unaffiliated personal ...   Tue 8th December 2009, 5:11am
GlassBeadGame   What a moronic hypothetical. Consider for examp...   Mon 7th December 2009, 8:14pm
One   It would seem to me that governments would be int...   Mon 7th December 2009, 8:34pm
GlassBeadGame   It would seem to me that governments would be in...   Mon 7th December 2009, 9:58pm
Milton Roe   Not considered a hazardous material, not serious...   Mon 7th December 2009, 8:04pm
CharlotteWebb   it's very hard to defend against a bunch of d...   Mon 7th December 2009, 8:08pm
Viridae   Fuck.   Tue 10th November 2009, 1:00am
Floydsvoid   Fuck. This guy is on the left coast, right? Hop...   Tue 10th November 2009, 1:51am
Abd   This guy is on the left coast, right? Hopefully t...   Tue 10th November 2009, 5:00pm
Abd   Fuck.Fuse, not fuck. Difference: with the former, ...   Tue 10th November 2009, 4:48pm
Peter Damian   Can you assure me you live nowhere near SW London...   Tue 10th November 2009, 4:51pm
CharlotteWebb   [quote name='Abd' post='203902' date='Tue 10th No...   Tue 10th November 2009, 4:59pm
GlassBeadGame   Well if you don't have a kid to put in a float...   Tue 10th November 2009, 1:54am
The Wales Hunter   Is the sale of smoke detectors regulated? Could ea...   Mon 7th December 2009, 6:13pm
dogbiscuit   Is the sale of smoke detectors regulated? Could e...   Mon 7th December 2009, 6:21pm
CharlotteWebb   Is the sale of smoke detectors regulated? Could e...   Mon 7th December 2009, 6:38pm
One   Perhaps all I'm trying to say here is: Wouldn...   Mon 7th December 2009, 7:59pm
Milton Roe   Perhaps all I'm trying to say here is: Would...   Mon 7th December 2009, 9:18pm
Abd   Well, I was banned for a year, the Cold fusion art...   Mon 20th September 2010, 2:57am
Herschelkrustofsky   Rlevse took time out of his busy day to ding me f...   Mon 20th September 2010, 5:06am
Milton Roe   [quote name='Abd' post='253053' date='Sun 19th Se...   Mon 20th September 2010, 4:04pm
Herschelkrustofsky   Allusion and metaphor also help in this struggle ...   Mon 20th September 2010, 8:56pm
Zoloft   [quote name='Milton Roe' post='253112' date='Mon ...   Mon 20th September 2010, 10:45pm
Subtle Bee   Abd needs to be a hummingbird in the rainforest, ...   Mon 20th September 2010, 11:29pm
Zoloft   Abd needs to be a hummingbird in the rainforest,...   Mon 20th September 2010, 11:36pm
Milton Roe   [quote name='Subtle Bee' post='253224' date='Mon ...   Tue 21st September 2010, 12:30am
Abd   I like cold fusion and I like you, but if there...   Mon 20th September 2010, 4:08pm
Zoloft   [quote name='Herschelkrustofsky' post='253068' da...   Mon 20th September 2010, 5:49pm
Milton Roe   [quote name='Herschelkrustofsky' post='253068' d...   Mon 20th September 2010, 7:15pm
TungstenCarbide   [quote name='Abd' post='253113' date='Mon 20th Se...   Mon 20th September 2010, 7:49pm
Milton Roe   Rlevse took time out of his busy day to ding me ...   Mon 20th September 2010, 4:21pm
Abd   Is this brief enough for Reviewers?. I helped to e...   Sat 25th September 2010, 6:19pm
GlassBeadGame   Is this brief enough for Reviewers?. I helped to ...   Sat 25th September 2010, 6:26pm
Herschelkrustofsky   The pseudo-skeptics on Wikipedia have continuousl...   Sat 25th September 2010, 8:36pm
Milton Roe   The pseudo-skeptics on Wikipedia have continuous...   Sat 25th September 2010, 8:43pm
Abd   The pseudo-skeptics on Wikipedia have continuous...   Sat 25th September 2010, 10:51pm
Abd   Things have heated up at Energy Catalyzer which is...   Fri 6th May 2011, 4:09pm
Abd   Whenever anyone would try to discuss cold fusion r...   Fri 6th May 2011, 4:52pm
gomi   here.]   Tue 10th May 2011, 12:35am


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