Please userfy this page Options Rating

[wjhonson]

Is there anyone here who is an admin (or higher) who will userfy a deleted page for me?

I do not wish to interact with the deleting admin, as that would not be productive for anyone. I'm fairly certain that they would refuse.

So you are a rogue admin, anonymous or not, willing to courtesy userfy this page

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=...=edit&redlink=1


Thanks

[Messedrocker]

This looks innocuous enough. I have no problem userfying it.

The page is now available at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Wjhonson...r_local_history

[Somey]

This looks innocuous enough. I have no problem userfying it.

On the contrary, that page isn't "innocuous" at all - it's part of Mr. Wjhonson's general (and quite sinister) effort to drop Wikipedia's BLP notability standards to little more than passing mentions in obscure news articles and blog postings, and return it to the days of easy, cheap revenge-grabbing (which, admittedly, some of us don't believe have actually passed).

Undeleting that page is far, far worse than what Everyking was desysopped for, and will have a far more negative impact on Wikipedia as well.

Wjhonson is one of Wikipedia's worst offenders when it comes to supporting anonymous libel and revenge against living, identifiable people.

Of course, I wouldn't expect an under-18 person such as yourself to realize that, now would I?

[The Joy]

Is there anyone here who is an admin (or higher) who will userfy a deleted page for me?

I do not wish to interact with the deleting admin, as that would not be productive for anyone. I'm fairly certain that they would refuse.

So you are a rogue admin, anonymous or not, willing to courtesy userfy this page

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=...=edit&redlink=1


Thanks

This isn't the place to make this kind of request. You should have made this request "on wiki." This is a criticism site unaffiliated with Wikipedia. Isn't there a "Request to Userfy" noticeboard somewhere on WP?

On the subject of your page, I don't understand how you can have a "local history" project on a global project like Wikipedia. I could understand a "History of Boston" or "History of the Chicago-Metro Area" or something like that. Just "local history" does not make sense.

[wjhonson]

"The Cayman Islands" ? I wonder who that could be.

Anyone can see my list of contributions and make up their own mind about my worth to the project.

As far as making the request in-world, I did that as well before I came here.

The Joy, "Local History" doesn't refer necessary to a particular place, it refers to a type of history. The history of people who did not necessarily have a national impact. Such as for example a state senator, or the mayor of a large town who didn't make national news for anything.

These people may be famous locally, to some area smaller than a nation, and that's why it's called "Local" history.

[I modified my comments to remove one sentence that was a tad... direct.]

This post has been edited by wjhonson: Wed 23rd September 2009, 3:47am

[Milton Roe]

"The Cayman Islands" ? I wonder who that could be.

I won't dignify any of the rest of that rant with a response. Anyone can see my list of contributions and make up their own mind about my worth to the project.

As far as making the request in-world, I did that as well before I came here.

The Joy, "Local History" doesn't refer necessary to a particular place, it refers to a type of history. The history of people who did not necessarily have a national impact. Such as for example a state senator, or the mayor of a large town who didn't make national news for anything.

These people may be famous locally, to some area smaller than a nation, and that's why it's called "Local" history.

As far as I can tell, you're everything we don't like here on WR, trying to write BLPs of ordinary people on the web. Why don't you go first?

[Kevin]

As far as making the request in-world, I did that as well before I came here.

You mean where you failed to tell Peter what you wanted undeleting, or where you were told of an appropriate place to make a request?

[Somey]

I won't dignify any of the rest of that rant with a response. Anyone can see my list of contributions and make up their own mind about my worth to the project.

I'm referring primarily to your efforts on WikiEN-L, actually, where anytime someone makes a positive suggestion regarding greater care, caution, or respect for BLP article subjects, you're always there to argue vehemently against it. You were doing it just a couple of weeks ago. I could go back and find dozens of additional examples...

Moreover, you manage to come up with things that make me actually agree with Dave Gerard, which may be even worse, in some respects.

On the plus side, I've stopped reading WikiEN-L because everything you post there depresses me, making me think that there's not only no hope for Wikipedia, there's no hope for the Internet in general. So that's one less person paying attention to your fascinating internal discussions!

[wjhonson]

These people may be famous locally, to some area smaller than a nation, and that's why it's called "Local" history.

As far as I can tell, you're everything we don't like here on WR, trying to write BLPs of ordinary people on the web. Why don't you go first?

What are you talking about ?
I have no idea. Can you be more clear please?

What does anything I said have to do with writing BLPs, or with ordinary people on the web?

As far as making the request in-world, I did that as well before I came here.

You mean where you failed to tell Peter what you wanted undeleting, or where you were told of an appropriate place to make a request?

I did not "fail" to tell him, I deliberately did *not* tell him. There's a difference.

I was not told of an "appropriate" place to make this request, I was told to request it of him. I did not find that suggestion appropriate. Just as if I hire a person to do a job, and they screw it up, I don't find it appropriate to be told, that I must give them a chance to fix it.

I'd rather hire someone else to fix a screw-up, as would every other rational being in the entire cosmos (and some irrational ones as well).

I won't dignify any of the rest of that rant with a response. Anyone can see my list of contributions and make up their own mind about my worth to the project.

I'm referring primarily to your efforts on WikiEN-L, actually, where anytime someone makes a positive suggestion regarding greater care, caution, or respect for BLP article subjects, you're always there to argue vehemently against it. You were doing it just a couple of weeks ago. I could go back and find dozens of additional examples...

Moreover, you manage to come up with things that make me actually agree with Dave Gerard, which may be even worse, in some respects.

On the plus side, I've stopped reading WikiEN-L because everything you post there depresses me, making me think that there's not only no hope for Wikipedia, there's no hope for the Internet in general. So that's one less person paying attention to your fascinating internal discussions!

The amount of "care, caution and respect" we currently have for BLP article subjects, is already too much. That's my opinion. Evidently some others in the community agree with me. And that's where the policy situation stands. That I alone (praise God) have so much impact that I can swing the entire community on my pinkie is amazing to me. I never knew that, so thank you.

The hope for Wikipedia is to not hide it's head in the sand. If reliable sources state that Britney Spears is the product of an alien and a zebra than we should report it. If reliable sources state that President Obama slipped on a banana peel, fell down forty nine steps and then jumped up just fine because he is actually a robot then we should report it.

Our function is not to hide statements reported by reliable source simply because they make us squeemish.

[The Joy]

"The Cayman Islands" ? I wonder who that could be.

I won't dignify any of the rest of that rant with a response. Anyone can see my list of contributions and make up their own mind about my worth to the project.

As far as making the request in-world, I did that as well before I came here.

The Joy, "Local History" doesn't refer necessary to a particular place, it refers to a type of history. The history of people who did not necessarily have a national impact. Such as for example a state senator, or the mayor of a large town who didn't make national news for anything.

These people may be famous locally, to some area smaller than a nation, and that's why it's called "Local" history.

But specific wikiprojects already deal with local history. If I lived in Cook County, Illinois, I would likely be involved in the "Cook County, Illinois" wikiproject, or the Chicago wikiproject. I see no reason to belong to a "Local History" wikiproject. I studied history and I have done research in local history for my hometown. On Wikipedia, I would go to the wikiproject that deals with my geographic area and its history, not to the "Local History" wikiproject. It's superfluous. For a wikiproject to work, you have to have support. Do you have enough people willing to work on this?

Even if your project does get off the ground, you'll have to contend with WP's Notability and Reliable Sources policies (which can be a pain to find on local subjects, especially if the local papers don't keep archives and many don't keep their papers after X time has past), and be able to address and assuage BLP concerns (as Somey mentions). Even if someone in my hometown got on some of the news networks for doing something stupid like marrying a deer, I don't believe it would be right to have a Wikipedia article about him. You can't have a legalistic ethic on Wikipedia. Even if policy allows you to do it, you really need to ask yourself "should I do it?" Once you get a BLP article on someone, it is difficult to remove it or protect it from malicious intent. If you start it, the responsibility of keeping it clean and libel-free is in your hands. And if you can't do that, the BLP subject is going to be pissed.

And guess who he's going to be mad at?

[One]

Moreover, you manage to come up with things that make me actually agree with Dave Gerard, which may be even worse, in some respects.

That post made me laugh. David Gerard is right on the money sometimes. On the BLP issue, he's usually with the forces of truth and justice.

On Wikipolitics, I don't care about inclusionism or date formatting, or anything else--I'm essentially a one-issue voter, and I notice that some of the figures demonized on this site (SlimVirgin, David Gerard, Jimbo, and whoever else) are mostly in agreement on the BLP issue. As far as I'm concerned, these people are all allies of a more responsible Wikipedia.

The BLP extremists are an obnoxious minority (but of course, they couldn't have done it without the help of WP:CONSENSUS, a policy that seems specifically tailored for dysfunction).

[Alison]

The amount of "care, caution and respect" we currently have for BLP article subjects, is already too much.

(says it all, really)

[wjhonson]

But specific wikiprojects already deal with local history. If I lived in Cook County, Illinois, I would likely be involved in the "Cook County, Illinois" wikiproject, or the Chicago wikiproject. I see no reason to belong to a "Local History" wikiproject. I studied history and I have done research in local history for my hometown. On Wikipedia, I would go to the wikiproject that deals with my geographic area and its history, not to the "Local History" wikiproject. It's superfluous. For a wikiproject to work, you have to have support. Do you have enough people willing to work on this?

Even if your project does get off the ground, you'll have to contend with WP's Notability and Reliable Sources policies (which can be a pain to find on local subjects, especially if the local papers don't keep archives and many don't keep their papers after X time has past), and be able to address and assuage BLP concerns (as Somey mentions). Even if someone in my hometown got on some of the news networks for doing something stupid like marrying a deer, I don't believe it would be right to have a Wikipedia article about him. You can't have a legalistic ethic on Wikipedia. Even if policy allows you to do it, you really need to ask yourself "should I do it?" Once you get a BLP article on someone, it is difficult to remove it or protect it from malicious intent. If you start it, the responsibility of keeping it clean and libel-free is in your hands. And if you can't do that, the BLP subject is going to be pissed.

And guess who he's going to be mad at?

This project was to co-ordinate all other local history projects, under one umbrella. By the way, I have no idea what you mean by all these other local history project teams, I don't see them. Perhaps there are a dozen or so here and there, but that's not what this project was for. I haven't encountered them. But that's all beside the point. I ask for the page to be *userfied*. Anyone's assumption that that means I'm going to try to reactivate the project is misguided and irrelevant.

[The Joy]

Moreover, you manage to come up with things that make me actually agree with Dave Gerard, which may be even worse, in some respects.

That post made me laugh. David Gerard is right on the money sometimes. On the BLP issue, he's usually with the forces of truth and justice.

On Wikipolitics, I don't care about inclusionism or date formatting, or anything else--I'm essentially a one-issue voter, and I notice that some of the figures demonized on this site (SlimVirgin, David Gerard, Jimbo, and whoever else) are mostly in agreement on the BLP issue. As far as I'm concerned, these people are all allies of a more responsible Wikipedia.

The BLP extremists are an obnoxious minority (but of course, they couldn't have done it without the help of WP:CONSENSUS, a policy that seems specifically tailored for dysfunction).

I do recall Daniel Brandt praising Slim Virgin for her BLP stance and trying hard to remove Daniel's bio. Many here do try to give people credit when they do the right thing.

Still, one good deed is not enough to redeem a man of a lifetime of wickedness.

[wjhonson]

I do recall Daniel Brandt praising Slim Virgin for her BLP stance and trying hard to remove Daniel's bio. Many here do try to give people credit when they do the right thing.

Still, one good deed is not enough to redeem a man of a lifetime of wickedness.

"Daniel Brandt" gets 42000 Googs.
Seems notable.
I only get ...oops... 110000 ...

I'd better shut up.

[Moulton]

There's not only no hope for Wikipedia, there's no hope for the Internet in general.

Alas, I have a similar fear.

The amount of "care, caution and respect" we currently have for BLP article subjects, is already too much.

(says it all, really)

Alison, could you coach Emesee on the appropriate use of emoticons?

[Apathetic]

This isn't the place to make this kind of request. You should have made this request "on wiki." This is a criticism site unaffiliated with Wikipedia. Isn't there a "Request to Userfy" noticeboard somewhere on WP?

WP:REFUND

[carbuncle]

I do recall Daniel Brandt praising Slim Virgin for her BLP stance and trying hard to remove Daniel's bio. Many here do try to give people credit when they do the right thing.

Still, one good deed is not enough to redeem a man of a lifetime of wickedness.

"Daniel Brandt" gets 42000 Googs.
Seems notable.
I only get ...oops... 110000 ...

I'd better shut up.

I guess we'd better get that article started:

Registrant:
County Historian
Will Johnson
180 Seventh Ave#102
Santa Cruz, Ca 95062
US
+1.8314777125

Knol: http://knol.google.com/k/will-johnson/will...4hmquk6fx4gu/1# (In future, please wear a shirt when posing for photos - think of the children!)

[LaraLove]

The amount of "care, caution and respect" we currently have for BLP article subjects, is already too much.

You should be banned from the project.

Knol: http://knol.google.com/k/will-johnson/will...4hmquk6fx4gu/1# (In future, please wear a shirt when posing for photos - think of the children!)

Freelance biographer. $25 per hour. Pushing Wikipedia to allow biographies on the "faintly notable". OH MY! Do we have a paid editor here pushing us to change Wikipedia policy in such a way as to further open up living people to libel so that he, a morally bankrupt "biographer", can make a few bucks?

Hmm... the powers that be on the big W.P. might be interested to see this.

[GlassBeadGame]

The amount of "care, caution and respect" we currently have for BLP article subjects, is already too much.

You should be banned from the project.

Knol: http://knol.google.com/k/will-johnson/will...4hmquk6fx4gu/1# (In future, please wear a shirt when posing for photos - think of the children!)

Freelance biographer. $25 per hour. Pushing Wikipedia to allow biographies on the "faintly notable". OH MY! Do we have a paid editor here pushing us to change Wikipedia policy in such a way as to further open up living people to libel so that he, a morally bankrupt "biographer", can make a few bucks?

Hmm... the powers that be on the big W.P. might be interested to see this.

Nawh, just another soldier in Web 2.0's reserve army of labour.