The Wikipedia Review: A forum for discussion and criticism of Wikipedia
Wikipedia Review Op-Ed Pages

Welcome, Guest! ( Log In | Register )

 
Reply to this topicStart new topic
> Modus Dolens, Way To Pain❢
Jon Awbrey
post Wed 2nd March 2011, 3:01pm
Post #1


τὰ δέ μοι παθήματα μαθήματα γέγονε
*********

Group: Moderators
Posts: 6,783
Joined: Sun 6th Apr 2008, 4:52am
From: Meat Puppet Nation
Member No.: 5,619

WP user page - talk
check - contribs



There's a mode of inference that has become so popular in certain quarters that I decided it was time to fashion a suitable name for it. It goes a bit like this:

QUOTE

If A, then B.

Not B.

──────────────────

But A simply has to be !!!


I know some scholars will quibble that it should be called “modus dolendo dolens” or something, but let's not be petty.

Jon Awbrey
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Text
post Thu 3rd March 2011, 1:13am
Post #2


Senior Member
****

Group: Contributors
Posts: 491
Joined: Sun 1st Nov 2009, 3:08pm
Member No.: 15,107



What does this mean?

If A has a value different from nothing then event B occurs. Then the opposite of event B occurs?

Since A only has to exist, and it always exists as a value, then B and its opposite always occur?
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Milton Roe
post Thu 3rd March 2011, 4:31pm
Post #3


Known alias of J. Random Troll
*********

Group: Regulars
Posts: 10,209
Joined: Thu 28th Feb 2008, 1:03am
Member No.: 5,156

WP user page - talk
check - contribs



QUOTE(Jon Awbrey @ Wed 2nd March 2011, 8:01am) *

I know some scholars will quibble that it should be called “modus dolendo dolens” or something, but let's not be petty.

Jon Awbrey

No. It was Mickey Dolenz (born Modus Dolendo Dolens, Jr., March 8, 1945), who was petty. Or at least, small. Some {{citation needed}} suggested that Modus should have retained his original first name, which was hip, but he said famously that he wanted to monkey with this first name, nobody should criticize. His bandmates agreed, saying that they were were too busy singing to put anybody down.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Jon Awbrey
post Thu 3rd March 2011, 4:44pm
Post #4


τὰ δέ μοι παθήματα μαθήματα γέγονε
*********

Group: Moderators
Posts: 6,783
Joined: Sun 6th Apr 2008, 4:52am
From: Meat Puppet Nation
Member No.: 5,619

WP user page - talk
check - contribs



QUOTE(Milton Roe @ Thu 3rd March 2011, 11:31am) *

QUOTE(Jon Awbrey @ Wed 2nd March 2011, 8:01am) *

I know some scholars will quibble that it should be called “modus dolendo dolens” or something, but let's not be petty.


No. It was Mickey Dolenz (born Modus Dolendo Dolens, Jr., March 8, 1945), who was petty. Or at least, small. Some {{citation needed}} suggested that Modus should have retained his original first name, which was hip, but he said famously that he wanted to monkey with this first name, nobody should criticize. His bandmates agreed, saying that they were were too busy singing to put anybody down.


I knew that someone else here would be Ancient Of Daze Enuff to abdeuce the Monkees as their first e-lusion, and I'm trying to get back to the task of x-planation, but I've just been e-lected Speaker for the Moral And/Or Silent Mojority, and I'm busy preparing my moral and/or silent address to the House of Pearls Before Swine (PBS).

Jon tongue.gif
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
A Horse With No Name
post Thu 3rd March 2011, 4:45pm
Post #5


I have as much free time as a Wikipedia admin!
*********

Group: Regulars
Posts: 4,471
Joined: Mon 26th Jan 2009, 1:54pm
Member No.: 9,985



QUOTE(Milton Roe @ Thu 3rd March 2011, 11:31am) *

No. It was Mickey Dolenz (born Modus Dolendo Dolens, Jr., March 8, 1945), who was petty. Or at least, small. Some {{citation needed}} suggested that Modus should have retained his original first name, which was hip, but he said famously that he wanted to monkey with this first name, nobody should criticize. His bandmates agreed, saying that they were were too busy singing to put anybody down.


We might as well shut the website down now...I can't see how it can get better than this. tongue.gif
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Gruntled
post Fri 4th March 2011, 3:01pm
Post #6


Quite an unusual member
***

Group: On Vacation
Posts: 222
Joined: Tue 2nd Feb 2010, 12:23pm
Member No.: 16,954



QUOTE(Text @ Thu 3rd March 2011, 1:13am) *

What does this mean?

If A has a value different from nothing then event B occurs. Then the opposite of event B occurs?

Since A only has to exist, and it always exists as a value, then B and its opposite always occur?

It means that if we can prove that:
* if A is true then B must be true
* B is false

then logically A must be false, yet some people persist in saying that A must be true.

For example, if John Smith lives in Des Moines, it follows that he lives in the USA. If we can prove that he doesn't live in the USA, he can't live in Des Moines. Yet there may be people who insist he does, maybe invoking WP:NOR.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Zoloft
post Thu 10th March 2011, 1:37am
Post #7


May we all find solace in our dreams.
******

Group: Regulars
Posts: 1,332
Joined: Fri 15th Jan 2010, 11:08pm
From: Erewhon
Member No.: 16,621



QUOTE(Gruntled @ Fri 4th March 2011, 7:01am) *

QUOTE(Text @ Thu 3rd March 2011, 1:13am) *

What does this mean?

If A has a value different from nothing then event B occurs. Then the opposite of event B occurs?

Since A only has to exist, and it always exists as a value, then B and its opposite always occur?

It means that if we can prove that:
* if A is true then B must be true
* B is false

then logically A must be false, yet some people persist in saying that A must be true.

For example, if John Smith lives in Des Moines, it follows that he lives in the USA. If we can prove that he doesn't live in the USA, he can't live in Des Moines. Yet there may be people who insist he does, maybe invoking WP:NOR.

I've seen people invoke WP:SYN as well. That Wikipedia has firm policies against both independent but verifiable research, and logical synthesis is appalling. I understand the policy is to only use reliable sources to prevent cranks from interring their own Time Cube sort of cranky theories deep in the fertile loam of Wikipedia, but it removes logical discourse as an option.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Kelly Martin
post Thu 10th March 2011, 3:22am
Post #8


Bring back the guttersnipes!
********

Group: Regulars
Posts: 3,270
Joined: Sun 22nd Jun 2008, 4:41am
From: EN61bw
Member No.: 6,696



QUOTE(Zoloft @ Wed 9th March 2011, 7:37pm) *
I've seen people invoke WP:SYN as well. That Wikipedia has firm policies against both independent but verifiable research, and logical synthesis is appalling. I understand the policy is to only use reliable sources to prevent cranks from interring their own Time Cube sort of cranky theories deep in the fertile loam of Wikipedia, but it removes logical discourse as an option.
In Wikiworld, encyclopedia authors are not expected to think, they merely inhale the ideas of others and regurgitate them in slightly modified form and order. And this is considered good, in fact ideal, because it prevents knowledge from being accidentally created. Only authorized knowledge creators should be allowed to create knowledge, you know.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post

Reply to this topicStart new topic
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

 

-   Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 2nd 9 14, 2:01pm