From: risker.wp at gmail.com (Risker)
Date: Mon, 21 Jun 2010 22:31:46 -0400
Subject: [arbcom-l] Fwd: [Foundation-l] Donation of Encyclopedic Entries on
Famous Poems
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimwHSfcROW-_8eo4P1e9mifmGmNWae9zHQnYMB7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTimwHSfcROW-_8eo4P1e9mifmGmNWae9zHQnYMB7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimM8VVMx4Lu_SqqHn3BL9c8akW5-QoyTfTvNMvv@mail.gmail.com>
The six-month period before Ottava Rima can appeal his ban was up yesterday.
I think we can probably expect to hear from him soon.
Risker/Anne
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Jeffrey Peters <17peters at cardinalmail.cua.edu>
Date: 21 June 2010 20:05
Subject: [Foundation-l] Donation of Encyclopedic Entries on Famous Poems
To: foundation-l at lists.wikimedia.org
Dear List,
My name is Jeffrey Peters, a professional researcher who is currently
working on my dissertation (dealing with Romantic poetry) and in addition
Masters in Classical Lit. I am writing to you today to announce the donation
of two fully written pages on two important poems of the English language:
Wordsworth's *Ode: Intimations of Immortality* and Coleridge's *Kubla Khan*.
Their current pages are almost stub level and contain many errors and
problems. Both rewrites/expansions can be found on Simple Wikipedia, a
project that is noble and deserves more involvement by the community as a
whole:
http://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Otta..._of_Immortality
http://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Ottava_Rima/Kubla_Khan
The above are works of love, and I dedicated dozens of hours at multiple DC
university libraries compiling research that, as far as I can tell, cannot
be found elsewhere in such a complete and concise form in print or on the
internet. I have provided my time and abilities to produce the page for the
betterment of the WMF and Wikipedia as a whole. I do so because of four
individuals who have inspired me over the last year: Jimbo Wales (for his
dedication to the idea of a free and complete encyclopedia), Samuel Klein
(for his dedication to the projects and valiant effort to ensure high
quality), Cary Bass (for the massive amount of time he puts in ensuring that
volunteers are able to succeed), and Philippe Beaudette (for striving to
make the WMF more academic friendly).
Previously, I donated the material for Elegy Written in a Country Churchyard
but I did not compile one whole page with every aspect but included material
in a piecemeal fashion. This did not work as well as I hoped, so I put in
the additional effort to ensure that the pages can be considered "complete",
though they may need additional minor copyedits to remove any final errors.
I hope that my donation today will aid Wikipedia's continuing quest to
provide a free and educational encyclopedia, and I hope that the level of
effort and critical eye, to an extent that appears unrivaled in any current
poetry page (even in my previous works), will attract more people to
Wikipedia who shall do the same.
Sincerely,
Jeffrey Peters
aka Ottava Rima
----------
From User.CoolHandLuke at gmail.com Tue Jun 22 03:17:55 2010
From: User.CoolHandLuke at gmail.com (Cool Hand Luke)
Date: Mon, 21 Jun 2010 22:17:55 -0500
Subject: [arbcom-l] Fwd: [Foundation-l] Donation of Encyclopedic Entries
on Famous Poems
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimM8VVMx4Lu_SqqHn3BL9c8akW5-QoyTfTvNMvv@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTimwHSfcROW-_8eo4P1e9mifmGmNWae9zHQnYMB7@mail.gmail.com>
<AANLkTimM8VVMx4Lu_SqqHn3BL9c8akW5-QoyTfTvNMvv@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinIfTuGRANV12g5Ds5NostmeCP6BgdPAU1NzW0k@mail.gmail.com>
Recused due to incredibly negative interaction with the user off site.
Frank
----------
From kenneth at planetkh.com Wed Jun 23 18:49:31 2010
From: kenneth at planetkh.com (Kenneth Kua/ArbCom)
Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2010 02:49:31 +0800
Subject: [arbcom-l] Fwd: [Foundation-l] Donation of Encyclopedic Entries
on Famous Poems
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimM8VVMx4Lu_SqqHn3BL9c8akW5-QoyTfTvNMvv@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTimwHSfcROW-_8eo4P1e9mifmGmNWae9zHQnYMB7@mail.gmail.com>
<AANLkTimM8VVMx4Lu_SqqHn3BL9c8akW5-QoyTfTvNMvv@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimiKfPHCbRoMg1lmjRRIllDzrLZRWmwuWICUztS@mail.gmail.com>
Oh wow. Time flies!
Kenneth/MD
On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 10:31 AM, Risker <risker.wp at gmail.com> wrote:
> The six-month period before Ottava Rima can appeal his ban was up
> yesterday. I think we can probably expect to hear from him soon.
>
> Risker/Anne
-----------
From 17peters at cardinalmail.cua.edu Sat Jun 26 04:23:40 2010
From: 17peters at cardinalmail.cua.edu (Jeffrey Peters)
Date: Sat, 26 Jun 2010 00:23:40 -0400
Subject: [arbcom-l] Ottava Rima
Message-ID: <AANLkTimTz4ttSssvMaScnd5hZeUonLec9STFLOWq7a3C@mail.gmail.com>
Dear ArbCom,
As most of you know, I don't really feel that I would gain anything from
being unblocked. I was harassed for two years, which got in the way of my
producing content. As you can see, I can still put forth beautiful content
and I lack the harassment.
But I don't get to help out where things are needed: GAN or FAC. Both are
backlogged. I was responsible for hundreds of thorough reviews at both.
I've talked to multiple arbs so far, and I don't really see anything. People
want my attitude to change, or my personality to change. But I'm a prick.
I'm a snob. I'm an elitist. We all know that.
I gave Jdelanoy to talk on my behalf with various Arbs, and he said "how low
would you be willing to go" in terms of any kind of bargain. I said I would
be willing to be limited to just 20 authors and their individual works and
be allowed to do work with GAN and FAC.
Why 20? Well, 10 primarily, but, as I said, I wanted to finish 20 authors
and their works so I could go. I have a list if you wanted to know.
I'm also sitting on tons of material, and, as I showed, I am willing to work
that up and put that forth regardless of my status.
So, here I am, and there you are.
Sincerely,
Jeffrey Peters
aka Ottava Rima
-----------
From dyellope.wiki at gmail.com Sat Jun 26 06:53:50 2010
From: dyellope.wiki at gmail.com (David Yellope)
Date: Sat, 26 Jun 2010 02:53:50 -0400
Subject: [arbcom-l] Ottava Rima
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimTz4ttSssvMaScnd5hZeUonLec9STFLOWq7a3C@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTimTz4ttSssvMaScnd5hZeUonLec9STFLOWq7a3C@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimc7LdttqUwZXeCOklWZ6T-CdSQo3wXmFeePOA6@mail.gmail.com>
Key sentence here:
"I've talked to multiple arbs so far, and I don't really see anything.
People want my attitude to change, or my personality to change. But I'm a
prick. I'm a snob. I'm an elitist. We all know that."
No deal, period, is my opinion.
----------
From dyellope.wiki at gmail.com Sat Jun 26 07:01:01 2010
From: dyellope.wiki at gmail.com (David Yellope)
Date: Sat, 26 Jun 2010 03:01:01 -0400
Subject: [arbcom-l] Ottava Rima
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimTz4ttSssvMaScnd5hZeUonLec9STFLOWq7a3C@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTimTz4ttSssvMaScnd5hZeUonLec9STFLOWq7a3C@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimik00iO6SjfLebbKlTVZVezVjSZuHPdgPOra0z@mail.gmail.com>
Hello, Jeffrey.
This email is to let you know that the Arbitration Committee has received
your email and will discuss this. When we've come to a decision, or if we
need further information, we will reply again.
David Yellope
On Sat, Jun 26, 2010 at 12:23 AM, Jeffrey Peters <
17peters at cardinalmail.cua.edu> wrote:
> Dear ArbCom,
>
> As most of you know, I don't really feel that I would gain anything from
----------
From rlevse at cox.net Sat Jun 26 11:46:46 2010
From: rlevse at cox.net (Randy Everette)
Date: Sat, 26 Jun 2010 07:46:46 -0400
Subject: [arbcom-l] Ottava Rima
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimTz4ttSssvMaScnd5hZeUonLec9STFLOWq7a3C@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTimTz4ttSssvMaScnd5hZeUonLec9STFLOWq7a3C@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <01dd01cb1525$41512000$c3f36000$@net>
Everyone not have a heart attack here.
I'm actually willing to give this a serious unban look. Why? Not because I
simply want to keep to my promise to unban one person. But I actually detect
a change in Ottava's attitude here. Thouhts?
R
------------
From rlevse at cox.net Sat Jun 26 11:50:47 2010
From: rlevse at cox.net (Randy Everette)
Date: Sat, 26 Jun 2010 07:50:47 -0400
Subject: [arbcom-l] Ottava Rima
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimik00iO6SjfLebbKlTVZVezVjSZuHPdgPOra0z@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTimTz4ttSssvMaScnd5hZeUonLec9STFLOWq7a3C@mail.gmail.com>
<AANLkTimik00iO6SjfLebbKlTVZVezVjSZuHPdgPOra0z@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <01e701cb1525$d10378b0$730a6a10$@net>
(list only)
Yea, that concerned me too but I detect a change from the other parts.
And people thought I was a hard ass -
R
From: arbcom-l-bounces at lists.wikimedia.org
[mailto:arbcom-l-bounces at lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of David Yellope
Sent: Saturday, June 26, 2010 3:01 AM
To: English Arbitration Committee mailing list; Jeffrey Peters
Subject: Re: [arbcom-l] Ottava Rima
Hello, Jeffrey.
This email is to let you know that the Arbitration Committee has received
your email and will discuss this. When we've come to a decision, or if we
need further information, we will reply again.
David Yellope
-----------
From marc at uberbox.org Sat Jun 26 13:24:24 2010
From: marc at uberbox.org (Marc A. Pelletier)
Date: Sat, 26 Jun 2010 09:24:24 -0400
Subject: [arbcom-l] Ottava Rima
In-Reply-To: <01dd01cb1525$41512000$c3f36000$@net>
References: <AANLkTimTz4ttSssvMaScnd5hZeUonLec9STFLOWq7a3C@mail.gmail.com>
<01dd01cb1525$41512000$c3f36000$@net>
Message-ID: <4C25FF88.4030501@uberbox.org>
On 26/06/2010 7:46 AM, Randy Everette wrote:
> Everyone not have a heart attack here.
>
>
>
> I'm actually willing to give this a serious unban look. Why? Not because I
> simply want to keep to my promise to unban one person. But I actually detect
> a change in Ottava's attitude here. Thouhts?
>
Well, in all fairness, he /did/ seem to simmer down a bit in the last
couple months. I still don't think he really understands what happened,
but I'd be willing to give him a chance on a short leash.
But he needs to be reminded that, since this project is a
*collaborative* endeavor, he needs to /work/ with people - including
people he finds disagreeable - or it can't work.
-- Coren / Marc
-----------
From rlevse at cox.net Sat Jun 26 14:02:29 2010
From: rlevse at cox.net (Randy Everette)
Date: Sat, 26 Jun 2010 10:02:29 -0400
Subject: [arbcom-l] Ottava Rima
In-Reply-To: <4C25FF88.4030501@uberbox.org>
References: <AANLkTimTz4ttSssvMaScnd5hZeUonLec9STFLOWq7a3C@mail.gmail.com> <01dd01cb1525$41512000$c3f36000$@net>
<4C25FF88.4030501@uberbox.org>
Message-ID: <021f01cb1538$371424d0$a53c6e70$@net>
Absolutely
-----Original Message-----
From: arbcom-l-bounces at lists.wikimedia.org
[mailto:arbcom-l-bounces at lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of Marc A. Pelletier
Sent: Saturday, June 26, 2010 9:24 AM
To: English Arbitration Committee mailing list
Subject: Re: [arbcom-l] Ottava Rima
On 26/06/2010 7:46 AM, Randy Everette wrote:
> Everyone not have a heart attack here.
>
>
>
> I'm actually willing to give this a serious unban look. Why? Not because I
> simply want to keep to my promise to unban one person. But I actually
detect
> a change in Ottava's attitude here. Thouhts?
>
Well, in all fairness, he /did/ seem to simmer down a bit in the last
couple months. I still don't think he really understands what happened,
but I'd be willing to give him a chance on a short leash.
But he needs to be reminded that, since this project is a
*collaborative* endeavor, he needs to /work/ with people - including
people he finds disagreeable - or it can't work.
-- Coren / Marc
-----------
From risker.wp at gmail.com Sat Jun 26 16:01:20 2010
From: risker.wp at gmail.com (Risker)
Date: Sat, 26 Jun 2010 12:01:20 -0400
Subject: [arbcom-l] Ottava Rima
In-Reply-To: <021f01cb1538$371424d0$a53c6e70$@net>
References: <AANLkTimTz4ttSssvMaScnd5hZeUonLec9STFLOWq7a3C@mail.gmail.com>
<01dd01cb1525$41512000$c3f36000$@net>
<4C25FF88.4030501@uberbox.org>
<021f01cb1538$371424d0$a53c6e70$@net>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimzH7SEBBYeclXnCMAd-eIGMblUI4Ce6huBwFoG@mail.gmail.com>
Ottava is sending a very mixed message here. He is certainly coming across
as asking *us* to give him a reason to return, rather than *him* giving us
a reason why he should be permitted to return. I don't think we should care
at all whether he "offers" to write 10 or 20 or 50 FAs, or to do FA or GA
reviews (remembering that many of the people who commented on his
self-initiated RFAR also worked in those areas), because he wasn't banned
for his work in those areas. He was banned because of his behaviour and his
manner of communicating.
I did have an IRC chat with him last night (log available to anyone who
wants it, and please compare it to the copy of the log that Ottava is
reportedly already circulating). I think it would be unfair of me to
characterise it in any way. He mentions several other past and present
members of the committee.
He also mentions Jdelanoy agreeing to be his emissary. Jdelanoy tells me he
didn't agree to that role at all, but didn't actually say "no" either; he
says he told Ottava that he wanted to review the situation before deciding.
The issues that got Ottava blocked were an inability to step back from
arguments, an inherently combative approach to communication, and
inconsistent ability to work collaboratively. He's remained active within
WMF projects throughout the ban, so our best sources of information will be
the projects and activities where he's put in significant work. As far as I
can tell, these are:
- Wikiversity. There has been a lot of very strange stuff going on over
there this year, to the point that there's been discussion at the Meta level
about shutting it down due to its unclear mission. It's quite possible
Ottava is one of the more stabilising forces there; given the big-picture
situation, I'm not inclined to hold any "behavioural issues" on that project
against him.
- Simple English Wikipedia. No evidence of misbehaviour that I can see;
however, also no evidence of any collaborative behaviour.
- Commons. I think this is an area where we need to do some research; I
did have a couple of commons people ask me why Ottava was banned from our
projects, and simply gave them a link to our decision. The response was
"yeah, that sounds about right" but I haven't followed up much there. Here
is his block log on that project: *
http://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?t...h=-1&tagfilter=
*
- Foundation-L. On the same night as he submitted this appeal, he also
managed to get himself put on moderation on Foundation-L. I'll refer people
to that thread directly, which has to do with ASCAP and copyright.
- He's also made a lot of posts on Meta, so it would be worthwhile to see
the interactions there.
Honestly, I have no idea what to make of this. The whole point of the ban is
to remove the noxious behaviour from the project. Unless we have some pretty
solid evidence that the behavioural pattern has changed, I don't see how we
can justify lifting the ban, but I want to see the evidence before making a
decision here.
Risker/Anne
----------
From rlevse at cox.net Sat Jun 26 16:58:26 2010
From: rlevse at cox.net (Randy Everette)
Date: Sat, 26 Jun 2010 12:58:26 -0400
Subject: [arbcom-l] Ottava Rima
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimzH7SEBBYeclXnCMAd-eIGMblUI4Ce6huBwFoG@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTimTz4ttSssvMaScnd5hZeUonLec9STFLOWq7a3C@mail.gmail.com> <01dd01cb1525$41512000$c3f36000$@net> <4C25FF88.4030501@uberbox.org> <021f01cb1538$371424d0$a53c6e70$@net>
<AANLkTimzH7SEBBYeclXnCMAd-eIGMblUI4Ce6huBwFoG@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <023a01cb1550$cbc73c30$6355b490$@net>
Mixed is spot on.
I'm sure he mentioned me in his chat. He's always felt I betrayed/deceived
him when I dropped from writing the PD in his case. I was trying to do a
mentor thing for him but he kept being a butthead and got banned. In his
mind I betrayed him when the real reason, as all 2009 members know, is I
dropped off the case due to significant wikistress.
R
----------
From User.CoolHandLuke at gmail.com Sat Jun 26 18:32:28 2010
From: User.CoolHandLuke at gmail.com (Cool Hand Luke)
Date: Sat, 26 Jun 2010 13:32:28 -0500
Subject: [arbcom-l] Ottava Rima
In-Reply-To: <4C2640E2.2010805@googlemail.com>
References: <AANLkTimTz4ttSssvMaScnd5hZeUonLec9STFLOWq7a3C@mail.gmail.com>
<01dd01cb1525$41512000$c3f36000$@net>
<4C25FF88.4030501@uberbox.org>
<021f01cb1538$371424d0$a53c6e70$@net>
<AANLkTimzH7SEBBYeclXnCMAd-eIGMblUI4Ce6huBwFoG@mail.gmail.com>
<023a01cb1550$cbc73c30$6355b490$@net>
<4C2640E2.2010805@googlemail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTikDXWjLkt1Le3-FWNP1U6nWeAZ9Hof9ETKvWC5e@mail.gmail.com>
Folks might want to read the parallel thread on WR, where he basically asks
whether he should even bother appealing his ban (his email here doesn't
really seem to be a request, but is the same sort of public monologue--"I
don't really feel that I would gain anything from being unblocked").
http://wikipediareview.com/index.php?showtopic=29944
No other comment.
Frank
On Sat, Jun 26, 2010 at 1:03 PM, Roger Davies
<roger.davies.wiki at gmail.com>wrote:
>
> I'd be very surprised indeed if something as deeprooted as vehemence over
> imagined slights could simply disappear completely over the course of a
> couple of months. Things like that are almost a defining part of the psyche
> and as difficult to get over as, say, the grief of a close bereavement or a
> divorce.
>
> Roger
>
>
>
> On 26/06/2010 17:58, Randy Everette wrote:
>
> Mixed is spot on.
>
---------
From User.CoolHandLuke at gmail.com Sat Jun 26 18:46:14 2010
From: User.CoolHandLuke at gmail.com (Cool Hand Luke)
Date: Sat, 26 Jun 2010 13:46:14 -0500
Subject: [arbcom-l] Ottava Rima
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTikDXWjLkt1Le3-FWNP1U6nWeAZ9Hof9ETKvWC5e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTimTz4ttSssvMaScnd5hZeUonLec9STFLOWq7a3C@mail.gmail.com>
<01dd01cb1525$41512000$c3f36000$@net>
<4C25FF88.4030501@uberbox.org>
<021f01cb1538$371424d0$a53c6e70$@net>
<AANLkTimzH7SEBBYeclXnCMAd-eIGMblUI4Ce6huBwFoG@mail.gmail.com>
<023a01cb1550$cbc73c30$6355b490$@net>
<4C2640E2.2010805@googlemail.com>
<AANLkTikDXWjLkt1Le3-FWNP1U6nWeAZ9Hof9ETKvWC5e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinJ7nM2BEw7HJnnR_eJa1fUrco6hTeDWROf-DeH@mail.gmail.com>
And I do intend to be recused from this, but I do not think it's well-known
to arbitrators here that he lost his Personal Message privileges on WR in
large part due to a series of messages he sent to me--threatening to "out"
me as an plagiarist unless I withdrew some posts I made about the US
copyright doctrine of fair use wherein I disagreed that attribution was a
requirement for fair use.
Here's the now-tarpitted
post<http://wikipediareview.com/index.php?showtopic=29579&st=20&p=237423&#entry237423>where
the PMs were accurately quoted:
QUOTE(One @ Sat 22nd May 2010, 10:44pm) [image:
*]<http://wikipediareview.com/index.php?act=findpost&pid=237421>
Ottava is now threatening to expose his purported evidence of my plagiarism
unless I retract the "attacks" on him, including where I argue that lack of
attribution does not forfeit fair use claims.
I expect him to post a new thread about it shortly. Take it for what it's
worth.
Actually, this is what was said (I love correcting liars)
Me: "You have far more to lose if I have to point out that you are a
hypocrite without an understanding of plagiarising if we have to go down
that road."
Him: This is a threat. I'm happy to debate whether or not it's a threat
publicly.
Me: "No, it is my strongest defense. You want to question my judgment on the
matter, the easiest way to show that you have no right is to reveal that you
were misusing sources in your works dating back to 2005.
If it was a mistake or intentional, that would be for other people to
decide. Those like (Arbitrator's name removed) honestly cared about their
articles and both the moral and legal consequences and fixed their problems
when it was pointed out. If you want to go the road of Roger Davies by
claiming your understanding is superior to other people's, there is an
obvious result."
Him: "I'd rather debate it publicly. Can I quote your charming messages?"
Me: "Only if you want to out (Arbitrator's name) as being one of the seven
plagiarising Arbs. "
Him: "Thanks for giving your permission. "
And someone should point out that I already removed a large example of him
plagiarizing out of good will to have him remove his attacks. If he doesn't
want to settle things civilly, that is his fault.
Note that the "(Arbitrator's name)" was KnightLago. Draw your own
conclusions.
Frank
----------
From rlevse at cox.net Sat Jun 26 18:47:22 2010
From: rlevse at cox.net (rlevse at cox.net)
Date: Sat, 26 Jun 2010 14:47:22 -0400
Subject: [arbcom-l] Ottava Rima
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinJ7nM2BEw7HJnnR_eJa1fUrco6hTeDWROf-DeH@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20100626144722.UP926.873695.imail@eastrmwml44>
And this was only a month ago, hmm.
R
-----------
From newyorkbrad at gmail.com Sat Jun 26 21:07:16 2010
From: newyorkbrad at gmail.com (Newyorkbrad)
Date: Sat, 26 Jun 2010 17:07:16 -0400
Subject: [arbcom-l] Ottava Rima
In-Reply-To: <20100626144722.UP926.873695.imail@eastrmwml44>
References: <AANLkTinJ7nM2BEw7HJnnR_eJa1fUrco6hTeDWROf-DeH@mail.gmail.com>
<20100626144722.UP926.873695.imail@eastrmwml44>
Message-ID: <AANLkTikW79z3CB5LOcyoZxjAxaw2JPqZcosrw4d_Qy-W@mail.gmail.com>
Risker, I'd like to see the chatlog. I'd also like to see his
version, if it is sent to anyone.
I'm at Union Station in Washington, where the DC meetup is starting in
20 minutes. I'll see if he shows up again this time.
I'll comment more in this thread when I'm on a real computer.
Newyorkbrad
On 6/26/10, rlevse at cox.net <rlevse at cox.net> wrote:
> And this was only a month ago, hmm.
>
> R
