QUOTE(Xidaf @ Fri 7th March 2008, 4:17am)
Milton, what do you think of the relation between Mantanmoreland and Samiharris? Do you think one is the sock of the other? If yes why was a sock used?
That's a good question. Of course, the last part of it is easier to answer. Samiharris (SH) is a very sophisticated sock, one never used anyplace other than with a proxified anonymizer, and thus immune to checkuser. There's only one reason to create such an account on WP: fear of checkuser. Which you have no need of, unless you're posting from another account, too. Thus, SH is a second generation sock-- one created by somebody on WP who's been caught by checkuser before.
SH is also a VERY specific sock, created with a single purpose: to edit short-selling/Overstock/Weiss/Bagley related articles in a neutral tone, with very careful citation. SH works hard not to have any fancy language or violate any WP rules. The only other topics SH edits are a few financial/investment guru bios.
SH is also created rather late-- in Jan, 2007. A year after Mantanmoreland (MM) first shows up, and sometime after MM's proven socks LE (Lastexit) and Tomstoner (TS) have been caught by conventional means. LE when Bauder nailed him with checkuser. TS when he and MM were caught editing each other's comments, forgetting who they were. So SH learns from this, and never makes any of these mistakes. Nevertheless, in edit summaries, where there's less time to think because the edit is waiting to be saved, SH and MM have very similar styles, and were caught using the same tics. Not so much when they get to writing prose. But SH is a very spare and economical writer. Almost as though afraid to say too much.
Now, WordBomb claims to have evidence that once, SH was caught using an IP at the same time GW was. The SH evidence being his logging into a webpage AS SH, and the GW evidence being from his being teased into looking at something on the web that only GW would be interested in, right then. So if you believe this, SH is certainly operated at least by GW. This is in keeping with his relative absense in editing in Oct 2007, when Weiss also almost disappears from his blog. Neither one quite goes away, but the gap is noticable.
That doesn't mean SH is entirely GW's sock. SH appears only a few months AFTER GW goes to India with MM to marry, and the socks operated by "MM" and LE have been nailed. It's quite possible SH is operated by both GW and his wife. Also the same for MM, which also takes a later mini-vacation in Nov 2007 (a year after the marriage), when editing of SH and also the Weiss blog drop.
Okay, why do I bring in the wife? Well, because I've probably been wrong about MM's origins, and certainly about the DTCC IP origins. I knew some (not all) of MM's postings didn't fit with GW. And I rejected MM and the DTCC IP as the Indian wife because according to Wordbomb she was busy working at the UN. But apparently she was busy doing other stuff also.
Remember how we know MM and GW are very close: they both mention Varkala, a dinky town in the south of Kerala state in southwest India. Varkala, population 40,000 is the seashore area of Kerala state. Weiss and wife marry there. Obviously the wife, an Indian national, is from that area. MM's edit times shift to India when Weiss (as we know from his blog) goes there to marry in Oct 2006. So they're either the same person or family. This I've said.
But, there's the matter of MM editing the St. Joseph's Church article Dec 25, 2006 and Jan 19, 2007. The last time apparently from the IP address of 22.214.171.124, which is the DTCC building. From this, Wordbomb infers a Weiss conspiracy with the DTCC to shortsell the Western world. I didn't believe it.
Well, I already looked at that IP's history, and noted that whoever operates it has been interested in film and India (lately, India economics). The first is Mantanmoreland's passion, and the second, of course is the wife's.
Now, couldn't GW, having married an East Indian wife, simply be interested in Indian topics? Yes, but we need to find out how that DTCC IP started. What was it interested in, on WP, before anybody knew it, or it knew it would be looked AT? It's like looking at the first murder of a serial killer-- often it's somebody personally known to them. So I just did what I should have done before, and Wordbomb should have done also (neener, neener, Wordbomb). I looked at that IP's first edit from the DTCC building, which occurs on April 11, 2005, a year before MM appears. It's to the TALK section of a long-renamed article on the "Namboothiri" (now renamed the Nambudiri for the WP article). Who were these? Why, they were the Brahmin lords of Kerala. You know, that state where Weiss wife is from, and where they got married? Wups, crap. This IP was originally the account of the not-yet-to-be Ms. Weiss. Who was working in the DTCC and editing WP from it, on the topic of the history of her home state, in April 2005, a year and a half before going back to Kerala to marry Weiss. The only other alternative is to imagine that Weiss way back in 2005, with his consultant badge and all, was using DTCC computers in 2005 to edit India articles, in just the way Wordbomb has suggested he's editing Catholic Church articles in 2007. This gets to be a very tall tale.
Other edits are also interesting from this early 2005 pre MM period (remember, MM only appears in Jan 2006). There's one about Tata Consultancy, an Indian software and business firm located not to far from Kerala, with offices in Mumbai on the West coast of India. And there's an entry from EGL, a computer development language. It's possible Ms. Weiss was in the DTCC doing student study on business. But it was also possible that she was on their computer system because she was coding for them. Just because Weiss may not be a tech type, doesn't mean his wife isn't. It would explain a lot about how much better SH is than Weiss' previous socks.
Now, who is Mantanmoreland, who first comes along (knowing all the ropes of WP, BTW) in Jan 2006, 9 months after the first DTCC IP edit? Well, by 2007 it's both the Weisses. There exist late MM comments (after the marriage) where the MM account switches back and forth the between colloquial American language, and stilted British India snideness (calling somebody's edit "nonsensical," for instance), within a space of 8 hours. A single account doesn't mean there's one person running it! Just because we usually look for two accounts and one person, doesn’t mean we sometimes won't find two people and one account. but I don't know who started the MM account originally in Jan 2006, because even though we know it went to India with the Weisses later that year in October 2006, it could have gone to India because of either of them.
In the early period (2005), the IP that we think is the-now-Ms. Weiss was interested mostly in Kerala, India, which makes me think it was originally Ms. Weiss. By the end of 2006, when both the DTTC IP and MM (which now had existed for a year) were editing the Catholic Church article, MM actually asks the DTCC IP to edit on a name-user basis. Then apologizes, saying he's "figured it out". I'll bet he has, since he's already married to the IP user, and now realizes who it is, duh. But I think here they're editing from different sites on the same topic (perhaps a place they'd both visited for Christmas), using the same account, without realizing the other is on. Or else it's a really clever ruse for MM to try to cover his DTCC IP. But that IP was interested in non-Weiss topics long before MM arrived. It may even be that here, in Dec or Jan 2006, is where Weiss and future wife meet.
So that's where I am. No firm conclusions, except that I think we can put Weiss' future wife in the DTCC in April 2005, long before Weiss is supposed to have been there. And doing that, we have no need for Weiss to go there in 2007. What's the point? If he wants to know what's going on in there, he's got a spy already. One busily studying the fine points of short selling for business school, and pillow-talking about it, with hubby.